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Subject: Greatest Military Leader Of All Time
Ad    11/30/2003 11:19:39 AM
This counts for everyone, from Hannibal to Paton.
My personal choice would be Wellington, as the only defeat was suffered in the siege of Seringapatam in 1799 when he was a 29 year old colonel of the 33rd. He successfully defeated all of Napoleans Marshells and the little Corsican himself.
However, if you disagree post your choice and your reasons. Cheers
 
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Elite_heroes    GREATEST MILITARY LEADER   1/3/2004 12:28:20 AM
Alexander was a ruler he had more responsiblities he never lost a battle and he was from a time when the world was still exploring military tactics and later generations to learn from and he did much good for the west but the matter does not rest in that so we wont go there. I am sorry about my history you are right it was the hun dude that lost to the romans sorry.... Anyway I would like to give credit to King Phillip II becasue he made the army alexander controlled and he taught him the tactics he knew so he was among the greatest military leaders of all time one over looked many times.
 
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Thomas    RE:GREATEST MILITARY LEADER Elite_heroes    1/8/2004 8:53:17 AM
After due consideration, I agree with the suggestion of Alexander the Great - he comes in first in all categories: 1. Succes - never lost. 2. Different campaings- never has a general fought so many different types of enemies. 3. Administration. 4 Logistics Kept an army on warfooting thousands of miles away from base for years. 5. economics : His monetary reform was very elegant. Alexander win hands down
 
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gf0012-aus    GREATEST MILITARY LEADER Thomas   1/8/2004 1:31:53 PM
You could also argue that Subodai did all of those things as well, in addition to managing two two armies hundreds of k's apart and then combining them to administer a coup de grace as part of a battle plan - plus he was using combined arms in a fashion that would not be seen until 1918 under General Monash. ie he had lighy and heavy cavalry, engineers, missileers, portable and light artillery, luggage trains etc etc... and these forces were managed by two armies - a logistics nightmare if wrongly applied. europe was lucky that there was a death in the family... otherwise they would have kept going west and south..
 
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count von moltke    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time   2/1/2004 4:44:37 AM
do field marshall general count von moltke (the elder ) claim as the greatest military leader ? as he form the world first general staff system . brain of all current army
 
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gf0012-aus    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - moltke   2/1/2004 5:05:12 AM
Moltke formed the modern western worlds first general staff system, not the worlds first.
 
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Kozzy    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time   2/21/2004 9:08:34 AM
Alexander
 
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BigR    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time   8/16/2004 2:04:45 AM
I'm surprised it took so long before ppl finally suggested Alexander of Macedon, was he too obvious? Theodore Aryault Dodge makes a strong claim for him in his book on Alexander. I mean by way of strategy and tactics you have to consider that the way of war prior to Alexander's advent was a rigid, almost sport-like contest, with formations and troop placement pretty much the same--everyone lined 'em up like battlefields were giant chessboards. With chariots (which history has proven to be a largely over-rated weapon), minimal tactics and simplistic manoeuvering. Warfare was young and immature, which makes Alexander's youth and genius all the more phenomenal. Philip may be credited with the invention of the phalanx and the massing of the army that Alexander was to wield, but either of the two battles with Darius will prove that Alexander's military know-how and innovation set the standard for war for millenia after his death. His ideas may not be advanced today, but we must remember that often what seem like obvious inventions were beyond imagination at the time. Also recall that Alexander had the ability to hold his army together even when marching through completely uncharted territory, talk about your fog of war, these guys couldn't be certain if crossing the next hill meant falling off the edge of the world! If he hadn't died at such a young age, there's no telling what sort of course Western history would have taken. PS no pincer movements in any of his most famous battles!
 
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BigR    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time   8/16/2004 2:09:51 AM
Furthermore, Alexander was the military brain many a great (and not-so-great) leader since has aspired to: from Caesar, Hannibal, Mithridates, to various Louis Hugenots, Napoleon, right up to Hitler and Patton.
 
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Ander320    British Bias?   9/5/2004 5:43:25 AM
"Get your point, yet wouldn't you agree that Wellingtons army was doing similar things? The inclusion of Riffle Batalions as an example? The French were the most powerful force on earth at this time, as you said your self, the Mongols were fighting very weak nations, whose military didn't match that of the mongols. How did they get on against Japan? Got a sound kicking. Wellington was never defeated by the French and indeed only suffered one defeat in a skirmish at night in 1799. He had with out doubt the greatest eye for a battle field, Salamanca for instance. " I wouldn't want to point all point already adress in an other tread but Wellington wasn't very famous at Redinha (1811), Toulouse (1814) or at several siege. In fact Redinha and Toulouse should be considered defeat to him if you consider Quatre-bras as a stalemate. At Redinha, Ney fight a bit of ground and made more dammage to a bigger force before retreating behind a good defense line (river). Ney 7500=> 200 KIA and WIA Wellington 23000 => 1800 KIA and WIA At Toulouse Soult does the same thingh. He inflicted a bigger bit on Wellington army than he receive and retreat to a good defensive line. Wellington 50000=> 8000 KIA and WIA Soult 30 000=> 4000 KIA and WIA At Rolica Delaborde have a much smaller force take a bit more casualties but succed to retreat in good order and join with his superior near Vimero. That would be at least equal to what Wellington did at Quatre Bras though much british said Delaborde was defeat at Rolica! Delaborde 4500 => 600 KIA and WIA Wellington 15 000=> 500 KIA and WIA At Quatre bras, Wellington take more casualties but retreat in order on a good defensive line. Wellington 50 000=>5400 KIA and WIA Ney 21000 => 4400 KIA and WIA
 
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GOP    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time   9/9/2004 2:53:12 PM
Patton
 
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Heorot    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - GOP   9/10/2004 6:14:03 PM
To suggest Patton over the likes of Alexander, Napoleon or Subotai (had you heard of him before this thread?) indicates either profound ignorance or profound stupidity.
 
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Ad    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - GOP   9/10/2004 8:20:40 PM
The point is Ander, that all military leaders have their weaknesses; Wellingtons happened to be impatience during sieges. To count Toulouse as a defeat, by the numbers alone, but be to count Badajoz or Ciudad De Rodriguez defeats. The British suffered the heavier casualties in the opening assaults (the garrisons were generally hunted down and butchered, which considering the hell of the enfilade at mount of the breach at Badajoz is understandable) Wellingtons career remained unblemished by a major defeat; the only question you could raise is over the siege of Seringaptam in 1799, where he led an ill fated night attack on the aqueduct. However, come morning, the Mahratta forces had withdrawn into the city itself, so in a sense it achieved its objective. This isn?t bias, this is merely fact.
 
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Ad    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - GOP   9/10/2004 8:21:51 PM
?but be to count Badajoz or Ciudad De Rodriguez defeats? But/Would*
 
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jastayme3    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - GOP   9/10/2004 11:00:09 PM
To suggest Patton over the likes of Alexander, Napoleon or Subotai (had you heard of him before this thread?) indicates either profound ignorance or profound stupidity ...................................... Patton was essentially a "hussar"-a repeat of the Jeb Stuart type. He was specialized in a particular part of warfare and he was very good at it. He made the raids pursuits and stabs, like cavalry commanders through the ages-he simply used tanks instead of horses. But he wasn't like Wellington who was a commander of whole theaters.
 
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Ander320    RE:Greatest Military Leader Of All Time - GOP   9/11/2004 10:15:29 AM
I gave you my point to compare Toulouse (wich was an openfield battle with some redoute à la Borodino) with Quatre bras. Now, i agrea Wellington didn't suffer any major defeat (Wterloo/Austerlitz style). But as you said any military leader as his weakness (no on perfect) and my point was aimed to some people who made Welligton a "uber" "invincible" tactician or operationnal commander and put everythingh as "victory" when the word draw at best is required. This type of comment on Wellington is way to important as are the (even more numerous) comment on Napoleon capacity.
 
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