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Subject:
Ospreys Over Afghanistan
SYSOP
10/26/2009 5:43:35 AM
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phrogdriver
1/16/2010 2:24:44 PM
First, don't patronize me by implying I don't now how my aircraft works.
Your proposed V/STOL Bronco would be very complicated. You're basically starting from a fresh sheet of paper on that one, whether you admit it or not. You can say it's a Bronco mod, but it's not. If I use a 747 and try to outfit it so that it can fly into orbit, the fuselage might stay the same (though probably not), but by the time everything's done, I've created an all new aircraft. It's a new build, new technology prototype you're proposing.
There are any number of aircraft and systems presently available or close to being available that can solve either part or all of the V-22 escort issue. While you seems to ascribe to me the mantle of trying to reverse-engineer Star Trek, I'm the one proposing more off-the-shelf answers.
The issue--observation of an LZ prior to insert, suppression or neutralization of the threat during the ingress and egress of tiltrotors, and fire support to a unit a couple hundred miles inland.
Short-range--AH/UH-1 helos supplemented by FARPs.
Medium-lang range--UASs/FW air provide observation of the LZ. FW air puts a TOT strike on the LZ prior to L-Hr. Supplement with a Harvest Hawk KC-130J for suppression/fire support in the LZ. An Osprey can be outfitted with a similar package as well. UASs may not carry guns soon, but they can carry low-collateral damage weapons to take out point targets in the LZ. Piasecki even makes a compound helicopter version of the Blackhawk that brindges some of the speed/range gap between helos and tiltrotors. Even all these together would cost far less than a tilt-Bronco.
The escort issue isn't as big as people seem to think. We're doing a decent job with just the airframes we have in the MEU now. We can improve in the future even further with just a few changes.
By combining existing assets, we can achieve the desired end-state. What I am getting at, or was trying to is, that we shouldn't think,"Wow, it'd be great to have a Bronco again." We should think,"We need accurate fire support at long range--how can we do that?" We have X,Y, and Z already that all do some of the job. How about we combine them in a different way to solve the problem.
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HeavyD
6/29/2012 7:38:28 PM
Could the Osprey have a 30mm side-mounted chain gun and an external stores pylon for Hellfires and guided Hydras, and Griffins? Perhaps but I just don't see alot more capability than attack helos at a much higher price.
A better platform would be the Grumman C2. We could definitely do a AC-130 Lite - pretty much the same electronics and twin 30mm chain guns plus Griffins and/or Hellfires or guided Hydras. Just not the 105!
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Reactive
6/30/2012 9:03:56 PM
Interesting debate here.
I can't for the life of me see that having got the platform and technology mature after almost 30 years they'd want to start from scratch to solve what appears to be a relatively minor challenge. The osprey, to me at least, seems somewhat like an engineering miracle, and that's come at a significant cost in both dollars and lives that I very much doubt there's much appetite to repeat, in either case surely suppression is best done by unmanned assets, Hellfire has several warhead options now including one well-suited for area-clearance and if there really is a need for a sustained firefight then a platform like Osprey, carrying a full complement be just about the worst platform to put in harm's way?
It's surely the same reason that the Chinook is not decked out like an Apache, mission creep usually ends up with abortions like the LCS : )
R
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