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Subject: Sidearms in the military, optional or not?
HYPOCENTER    9/25/2006 10:58:49 PM
I was wondering, if you're in the US military do you have the option of picking whatever side-arm you want.... I mean, if you wanted to use something other than the Baretta, could you? If not, why not, and are there any 'loopholes' that would allow one to carry something other than the Baretta? For instance, if I wanted to carry something rediculious and impractical, like the .500 S&W or .454 Casull, purely for status, could I?
 
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smitty237    sidearms in the military   9/26/2006 11:32:15 PM
I doubt that soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are allowed to carry non-issue sidearms, but I can't say for certain.  I would imagine that Special Ops troops are given a little more lattitude, but I would be surprised to find out regular grunts were carrying personally owned Glocks or M-1911's in their holsters on operations. 
 
When I was serving in the National Guard in the 1990's we spent most of one drill weekend at various ranges at Ft. Riley.  I tried to sign up to qualify with the  M9 Beretta, but was informed that I was not "authorized" to qualify with a pistol.  This was despite the fact that I was a law enforcement officer in civilian life and carried a handgun every freakin' day!  It kind of ticked me off, but that's life in the military.  Based upon that experience, I'm sure that only certain select soldiers are allowed to carry a pistol at all, even if it is the Beretta. 
 
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DarthAmerica       9/27/2006 1:08:02 AM

I was wondering, if you're in the US military do you have the option of picking whatever side-arm you want.... I mean, if you wanted to use something other than the Baretta, could you?

If not, why not, and are there any 'loopholes' that would allow one to carry something other than the Baretta?

For instance, if I wanted to carry something rediculious and impractical, like the .500 S&W or .454 Casull, purely for status, could I?


Not unless you were assigned to a unit or position that was assigned the other weapon. Some officers and NCO's sometimes develop an understanding with the supply SGT though and carry additional weapons NORMALLY in the unit armory. When I was assigned the M9, I would sometimes sign for an M-16A2 as well. But you cannot for example decide to bring your personal Glock 19 and carry it instead of the M9. Not only could you get in serious trouble for carrying an unauthorized personal weapon. But also if its necessary to consolidate and reorganize or if in a firefight someone needs an extra magazine and yours arent like the others it would cause logistical issues and potentially worse.

Besides, why would you want to carry something different? Especially with regard to pistols?
 
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Horsesoldier       9/27/2006 2:27:21 PM
No, officially you cannot do so.
 
It has been done in the current conflict, like pretty much any conflict in America's history, but if you get caught a best case scenario is having your military career torpedoed.  Worst case is criminal charges.
 
As for loopholes allowing carry of something besides a Beretta -- there are a few MOS's in the army that carry Sig P228s (M11) instead of the M9.  There are also some assorted units (many, but not all, special operations) that issue something besides the M9.  These days lots of people are getting handguns issued to them that the army did not think warranted a handgun ten years ago, and so a lot of commerical off the shelf purchases are making up for the shortage of M9s.
 
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snakemanmike       8/18/2008 11:45:33 AM
I am sure you have gotten this answer already, but in a single word "NO". I am a veteran of the Iraq war, serving there with the Tennessee Army National Guard, and I was issued an M-9, and an M-4. We were specifically forbiden to carry non authorized weapons. One young man in my company was caught carrying a non issue handgun, and was given harsh punishment at his Article 15. Reduced in rank from E-4 to E-1, fined 1 month's pay, and 30 days restriction after return stateside. And he was lucky that he didn't get a court martial, with its much worse penalties. There are a few special ops units that carry non standard weapons, but even those are going to have to be approved by their commands.
 
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theBird       8/21/2008 1:57:14 AM
When You're a full bird colonel though, the rules are different!
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:ColonelHickeyOpRedDawn.jpg
 
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phrogdriver       8/22/2008 1:15:25 AM
One, why carry extra kit like a rediculously huge pistol? There is no "status" associated with it. 
 
There are many pistols better than the M9.  However, those who really need a better weapon for MOUT or CQB, e.g. spec ops, generally rate them via their units.  SOCOM has a .45 in its T/E for this, and I believe some units have even gotten S&W .40s. 
 
I have known some to carry an "extra" personal weapon, but in practice its hard to do.  The military doesn't give you ammo for a personal weapon, and you have to have a way to secure it when not in use, as most unit armories won't take them, either.  Pilots generally realize that getting in a shooting match on the ground is suicidal, whether with a 9mm or a .44mag.  Crews at high risk of having to E&E, like helo crews, are often issued rifles/carbines in addition to their sidearms.  Grunts always have a rifle, anyway. 
 
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theBird       8/24/2008 3:20:38 PM
I'm not entirely sure, but I do know at a minimum you would need to get permission from your Commander and possibly JAG officer, and it would need to shoot only military issue ammo (it could be quite the incident if you shot an insurgent with a black talon round) so that means no .500 or .44 magnum.  You would also need to be friendly with Arms Room staff to have them add it into the inventory for taking it on the deployment once you've secured the permission.
 
Personally I am not a fan of personal sidearms, if you're given an M-4 and an M9 that ought to be good enough.  However, I do understand that for those not issued a sidearm, allowing them to supply their own weapon and carry it in the arms room as they would if it were an issue weapon ought to not be a problem but that's not always the case.  

 
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juan grande       8/25/2008 12:52:50 AM
I have a cousin serving in Iraq.  He learned on his first tour that the Iraqis really start paying attention when you point a pistol at them.  If you point a machine gun or rifle at them (especially if they're in a group) they know you won't spray the crowd.  If you draw your sidearm, that reminds them of Saddam's hit squads who would shoot people in the streets with their pistols.  My cousin carried a Sig-Sauer M11 compact 9mm his first tour.  On his current tour he bought a stainless steel .357 S&W with a 6-inch barrel.  His First Sergeant carries a 12 gauge trench gun.  Between the 12 gauge and the big shiny revolver, they have no issues with crowds.  My cousin still carries the M11 in a leg holster as his main back-up.  The .357 is in a shoulder rig just for show.  He only carries it out on patrol but his soldiers love that gun.
 
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juan grande       8/25/2008 12:55:06 AM

I have a cousin serving in Iraq.  He learned on his first tour that the Iraqis really start paying attention when you point a pistol at them.  If you point a machine gun or rifle at them (especially if they're in a group) they know you won't spray the crowd.  If you draw your sidearm, that reminds them of Saddam's hit squads who would shoot people in the streets with their pistols.  My cousin carried a Sig-Sauer M11 compact 9mm his first tour.  On his current tour he bought a stainless steel .357 S&W with a 6-inch barrel.  His First Sergeant carries a 12 gauge trench gun.  Between the 12 gauge and the big shiny revolver, they have no issues with crowds.  My cousin still carries the M11 in a leg holster as his main back-up.  The .357 is in a shoulder rig just for show.  He only carries it out on patrol but his soldiers love that gun.

My cousin is a captain so he probably gets a little leeway.
 
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Horsesoldier       8/25/2008 5:32:15 PM


My cousin is a captain so he probably gets a little leeway.

We actually usually expect officers to toe the line about uniform regulations and other military silliness.  Lead by example and all that. 
 
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