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Subject: Venezuela is it going to the way as cuba did in cold war?
analdestroyer    9/19/2008 9:35:33 PM
Hi all as you might already know, the venezuelans is tight with the russians, Venezuela's Hugo Chávez announced that his nation will host four Russian warships and 1,000 troops in November for joint military exercises. That was followed Wednesday by the arrival in Venezuela of two Russian long-range bombers. according to http://www.csmonitor.com/2008/0912/p01s05-woam.html and i heard that the bears might be based in venezuela, how is the US going to react to this?, how far the US will tolerate this?, its obvious that the russians might want to get back at US for its support in Georgia, and Hugo Chazes use this opportunity to his advantage, where will it leads?
 
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Thomas    How long??   9/20/2008 6:53:56 AM
The most interesting is that Chavez can actually do it. This means that it is not to serious. Otherwise the Monroe doctrin would have been invoked.
 
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warpig       9/23/2008 12:07:34 PM
Bets on how long into the deployment before "Peter the Great" suffers a breakdown?
 
---------------
 
Russian warships ready for trip to Venezuela: officials
by Staff Writers
Moscow (AFP) Sept 22, 2008
Russian warships including a nuclear missile cruiser are ready to leave for joint exercises with Venezuela, Russian naval officials were quoted as saying Sunday by the RIA Novosti news agency.
 
"A flotilla of Russia's Northern Fleet ships, including its flagship, the nuclear missile cruiser Peter the Great, destroyer Admiral Chabanenko and escorting ships, will shortly leave Severomorsk, the Northern Fleet's base," said Igor Dygalo, an aide to the chief naval commander.
 
"As a part of this trip, Russian warships will take part in joint exercises with the Venezuelan navy," he added.
 
"The ships are loaded with both training and live rounds, all is in good order and checked, the ships are technically sound, all crews are fully prepared, and spare parts are on board the warships and their escorts," Deputy Navy Commander Vice-Admiral Nikolai Karachun said.
 
President Hugo Chavez, who will visit Moscow this week, confirmed Tuesday that a Russian navy fleet will arrive in Venezuela's territorial waters in "November or December" to conduct joint exercises, the first of its kind close to the United States since the Cold War.
 
Two Russian TU-160 strategic bombers landed in Venezuela earlier this month to take part in the naval exercises.
 
 
 
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Softwar       9/23/2008 2:00:59 PM
The last time the "impotent" Peter sortied for any length of time - the draftee sailors nearly ruined the nuclear reactor.  It took them almost a year to clean iit up enough to deploy again.  This is not the first time ...  The Russian aircraft carrier - aka the Nutsoff - had to be towed to the exercise area in the Baltic and then towed back because its engines could only work long enough for the SU-33s to take off and land for the cameras.
 
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WarNerd       9/25/2008 4:38:20 AM
I would not get too worried about Chavez.  He's dependent on the oil industry that he is driving into the ground to supply funding for purchasing political loyalty from the poor.  It's reached the point that even with increased price of oil the net income is dropping, so he tried to make up the difference by printing more money and now has the highest inflation rate (35%) in South America.  Then, in an attempt to stop the inflation he slapped price controls on basic commodities including food and created a series of scarcity crisis with shops that can not afford to restock and farmers refusing to sell.  Meanwhile, his continuous expropriation of any enterprise that looks useful has driven foreign investment capital out of the country.
 
Chavez is basically ruling by decree.  Many of the military commanders are getting nervous that "Chavez is stimulating a preinsurrectional climate in the country", and Chavez is getting worried that they might stand aside if it occurs.  So Chavez is now creating a "politically reliable" military unit separate from the military that reports just to him.  The similarity of this to the origin of the brownshirts/SS/Republican Guard is not lost on the military, so they are probably getting even more nervous.
 
Venezuela is turning into a big house of cards and the collapse is likely to be sudden and unusually bloody, and is not far off.
 
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gf0012-aust       9/25/2008 5:10:41 AM

The last time the "impotent" Peter sortied for any length of time - the draftee sailors nearly ruined the nuclear reactor.  It took them almost a year to clean iit up enough to deploy again.  This is not the first time ...  The Russian aircraft carrier - aka the Nutsoff - had to be towed to the exercise area in the Baltic and then towed back because its engines could only work long enough for the SU-33s to take off and land for the cameras.

The last time they sortied a carrier they ended up losing their most experienced carrier pilot.
 
anyone serving on a russian ship deserves a medal.  if you look at how many sailors they have lost to sub accidents in the last 30 years you'd be gobsmacked.

 
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Softwar    Gf reply...   9/25/2008 9:00:28 AM


The last time they sortied a carrier they ended up losing their most experienced carrier pilot.

 

anyone serving on a russian ship deserves a medal.  if you look at how many sailors they have lost to sub accidents in the last 30 years you'd be gobsmacked.




You are quite right - forgot about that video of the Sukhoi cutting through the arresting wires and going over the edge into the drink.  I think its posted somewhere here on SP - If I find it - I'll put up the link.
One sub commander once told me that you could pick out a Russian nuke sub sailor in a room full of people....  just have them drop their pants and turn off the lights.
 
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