you don't need them to train people who would not want to be trained by them for whatever reason.... no big deal, let a man do it. but if a woman can do the job as well as a man then there is no reason why they should not do it... there are plenty of things I would want a woman in for... if I want to seduce/distract a terrorist then I would prefer a nice looking women for the job and not a 210lb tatooed hairy brut in a skirt.... :-)

I agree with Bluewings. First, a man is physically more able than a woman. Mentally too. I don't say that women cannot be strong physically and mentally as a man, but generally they don't). Women are less effective during their menstruation period. The last reason is: we can't allow any form of intimate feelings between members of a SF unit. Regarding that, I don't know why SF should be open to women just for political correctness.

Women have passed SF selection in the US & UK for certain. They are there; fact. If anyone has a problem, perhaps it is just your problem.

paul you are mixing up intel work and sf doorkicking types i think. intel work is about mental toughness and skills more than physical skills. if a spook needs to resort to punching/shooting etc the mission's probably pooched already. women can train for endurance etc the same way you can with men but their achilles heel is upper body strength. vanishingly few women have enough upper body strength to be competitive with men. ignoring the psych strains of women in small units it's just plain terribly difficult to find a woman who can shlep a 90 lb pack for 25 miles in a time even vaguely comparable to her male counterparts. you have for instance a recon team that needs to carry in 400 lbs of gear and supplies and needs to do it invisibly. if the woman on the team can only cart about 60 lbs what do you do about the other 40 lb of gear that must go in. going to lump another 13 lb of kit on the other men in the patrol? or thin the supplies out and hope you won't miss the 40 lb of "must have" kit?

I was looking at it from the whole spec ops side of things.... SAS might go door kicking but some of their missions involve non SAS members due to the skill set required for the task. SAS provide muscle that MI cannot. and MI provide skills that a SAS bod might not have....

That's true there are women in SF, not only US or UK SF. As I was mentionning Israël has several of them as well. But also as I said they don't have the same training test requirement as men, they also aren't sent often to "real" direct action but most likely for intel missions more than anything else. This is due to the fact as I said, women are less supsicious than men, there are lot of guys: "come on, she's not a spy, she's just a woman!". And through history they proved themselves useful in THIS field some as whores (no insult), nurses, girlfriends, wives, maid, etc... But never in the history women have been really efficient in the direct action field. She can't be a better sniper, women due to hormons can't be patient as a man so less stable and many other points. This isn't a question of being a macho, this is just a question of "who fits better where". In the past as I said I wouldn't want to have her in my unit if she wasn't able to do EXACTLY the SAME things as my other men. If she can't run and lift as much, then she's out, she hesitate more than others, same: out. Because it might appear a good idea to let women in although not being able to do the same. But in a mission a mistake can cost not only one life but several lives. And I'd not risk the lives of any of my men because some guy "thought" women in the special forces might be a good idea. PS: can you link me up to a site mentionning women in the US and UK direct action units? (I'm not trying to break your arguments I actually don't know perfectly the topic, I heard women in the Deltas but never in the Green Berets or the SAS) Thanks.

But never in the history women have been really efficient in the direct action field. She can't be a better sniper, women due to hormons can't be patient as a man so less stable and many other points. This isn't a question of being a macho, this is just a question of "who fits better where". curious and not looking for a fight.... (I have enough) is this an actual fact that women are not as patient as men???? surely this is an idividual trait rather than sex based... I know plenty of impatient men who would easily be beaten by women.... my wife waited 5 years for me to ask.... :-)

Mysoginist Sgt.: "women impatient due to hormones..." Haaaargh! Hardy! Hah! Shame on you Sgt. Feeling insecure?

Sad, but funny! Only every 30 days or so...........heheheheheheeh Crash

I already said: I'm not a macho. I do respect women who are to me the equal of us. I never had opinions biased on females. I just say what science proves about it: "Menstruating women start to produce progesterone in their ovaries after the lutenizing hormone ( LH ) surge around the time of ovulation (usally 14 days after the first day of the cycle). The progesterone level rises and falls just before the bleeding begins. This premenstrual time is called the progesterone withdrawl phase. For some women this period is felt as an exteremely anxious, nervous, "tempermental mood." Some women find it to be an extremely depressing time with tears and feelings of low self-esteem." - Dr Abraham Harvey Kryger "Dr. Abraham Kryger is well respected in the medical community for his extensive training and more than twenty-five years of experience in conventional, holistic and complementary medicine. He is a frequent source of expert commentary in the USA Today.com column "Spotlight on Health", the world's most widely-read daily medical, health and wellness column." Then: http://www.livescience.com/humanbiology/050706_pain_gender.html I think these guys are knowing a "few" about it if you don't trust me ;) I got personnal examples as well: my current girlfriend (I'm not really thinking about marriage right now although she does for both of us) lacks much more patience than I do. She's half-Tunisian from her mother and half-French from her father, she has been now in Tunisia for not even a week (5 days) and she spent already at LEAST 5 hours on phone calling me at odd hours. She sends me almost 15 sms on my cell phone daily. I do love her she does love me but isn't a tad "too much"? If you take examples I can always show you counter examples. Bring me a woman soldier and let's check how much she can walks with a 40Kg (for a lot of women it's large more over than half of her bdoy weight) bagpack and a 4Kg in the hands under the heavy sun of Africa... I think don't understand my point: I don't care about the sex of the soldiers. I look on technical aspects. I don't know if you've heard about testosteron? Here's what it is and why males are "stronger" than men: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone Please do read it, it's not that long but explains why a female can't do what a man does. Insecure? Be sure that if I had women in my units on the battlefield I'd be the first one to fall on them and teach them on my free time ;) I don't say women are weaker in a whole, but in SF they're not useful as a man is. But here's something about me: I can't resist a charming woman and this got me into troubles several times!