Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Armed Forces of the World Discussion Board
   Return to Topic Page
Subject: Israel vs. Iran in an all-out war
jaythehistorian    8/3/2006 12:24:39 PM
WHY ISRAEL WILL decisively defeat IRAN if there is an all-out war. 1.Israel has more than 200 atomic devices vs Iran which may have 1 soon.Even if Iran bought nuclear devices from other rogue states, the retaliation from Israel would be the equivalent of 2,000 plus hiroshimas. 2.The 200 plus Israeli atomic devices are unstoppable by Iran i.e. up to 80 can be launched by submarines and the rest by ICBM or F-15s or F-16s 3.Israel has the world?s most advanced anti-ICBM missle umbrella which may be impenetrable by Iranian Shahib missles . Iran can only deliver their 1-2 atomic warheads by ICBMs with no other delivery capabilities. 4.Israel has a satellite system with multiple types of spy satellites which have reached the limit of possible resolution (defraction limit) generally thought to be about 10 centimeters and their satellite system is all weather. Together with their advanced UAV capabilities , this allows Israel to possess the most detailed photos and real-time imaging of all Iranian military installations . 5.The military technologic difference between Israel and Iran is wide. Israel has about 10% of the world-wide arms export market which based solely on merit and immensely competitive. IF anything, it is nothing short of a miracle and a tremendous tribute to Israel (jewish ) expertise that they sell to so many countries which never take the side of Israel in any dispute. There are those ,who imply much of Israel?s technological edge is due to massive American aid. However, that aid also has restrained the development of Israeli military technology. American military contractors regularly and understandably, attempt to undermine Israeli sale of military technology when it is in direct competition with American contractors? efforts to sell abroad. Israel might have double the foreign military technologic sales if the US had never blanketly prohibited Israel selling directly to PRC. This is understandable. Iran sells nothing in world wide arms market. Their highly publicized Shahib 3 missle is nothing but a supped up version of the the 63 year old V2 Nazi ballistic missle. Israel supplies Israeli-developed military technology to most of the world?s top militaries including the USA, India, and China. China's J10 fighter is thought to be modeled on Israel?s Lavi.,the Israeli developed Jet fight. In terms of MBTs, Israel possesses 1500 consisting entirely of the modern highly regarded Merkava. Iran has approx. 500 all obsolete models including the T 72. In front-line aircraft Israel has approximately 800 with more than 500 being upgraded F15s and F16s. Israel also possesses in air refueling capabilities. Iran has about 250 front-line combat aircraft consisting mostly of obsolete older US and Russian fighters. It has no known in air refueling capability. Israel also is way ahead in production and use of UAVs and sells various models to many countries including Great Britain. There are other areas of military technology Israel is far more advanced than Iran.
 
Quote    Reply

Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7   NEXT
The Lizard King    Israel in Generalized Terms   8/3/2006 12:56:30 PM
The Israeli Armed Forces are designed to make deep gains in enemy territory. However, these gains are not sustainable for the Israelis. Their doctrine calls for them to be able to engage hostile forces & hold out until America and/or God comes. These guys wargame under armageddon-like scenarios. If you study war + religion, you will come to the realization that everyone believes God is on their side: Bush, Isreal, Hezbollah, etc....
 
Quote    Reply

univers    Israel couldn't defeat Hezbollah   10/22/2009 3:06:46 PM
 
Quote    Reply

univers    Israel couldn't defeat Hezbollah   10/22/2009 3:07:37 PM
 
Quote    Reply

smitty237    Depends upon the war   10/23/2009 2:49:32 AM
Israel has no force projection capabilities that would allow them to conduct an offensive ground attack against Iran.  That said, the same could be said for the Iranians.  In order to attack Israel in a ground war the Iranians would require the cooperation and consent of Iraq, Syria, and Jordan, and I doubt this would happen since Iran (Persia) has been a much bigger potential threat to those countries than Israel could ever be.  Theoretically Israel could launch an air strike against Iran, but this would be a massive undertaking, and would probably require the assistance of the United States.  An Isreali air attack would be a relatively small scale attack against specific targets in Iran.  I sincerely doubt that the Iranians could successfully repel such an attack.  The Iranians are completely incapable of launching an air strike on Israel without the assistance of Iraq and/or Syria, and even then I doubt they would be successful. 
 
Were the Iranians to launch a nuclear strike against Israel they would be obliterated........or at least Tehran and most of the major population centers in Iran would be.  The Iranians would probably also face massive airstrike (if not nuclear attacks) by the United States as well.  It would be suicide, but people with an apocalyptic world view may be willing to take the chance in order wipe Israel of the face of the Earth. 
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege       10/23/2009 5:31:56 AM
WHY ISRAEL WILL decisively defeat IRAN if there is an all-out war.
 Except using nukes Israel has no means to inflict sufficient damages to Iran.
They can not use more than a small fraction of their air power against Iran while Iran has means to bomb them with ICBM and using terrorism and Hezbollah.
Now it is granted that Isreal has much more advanced military means.

1.Israel has more than 200 atomic devices vs Iran which may have 1 soon.Even if Iran bought nuclear devices from other rogue states, the retaliation from Israel would be the equivalent of 2,000 plus hiroshimas.
So its means with your calculation that Israel has nukes with an average power of each nukes equivalent to 10  hiroshimas!
It means that each nuke would have an average power of 450 kt.
Hiroshimas was 15 kt but you need rougly a 30 time more powerfull warhead to achieve 10 time more ground effect (proportional to exponent 2/3 of warhead power).
Which is ridiculous considering Israel means and budget, and the fact they have never tested a thermonuclear device.
Considering Dimona capabilities, and Israel budget, Israel has mainly small fissions warhead Hiroshima sized, plus some bigger boosted fission warheads on its IRBM so an equivalent probably of 400 or 500 hiroshimas, which is still remarkable.
To just give a comparison France has roughly 1500 Hiroshima capability now while spending 5 billions US $ a year on its deterrent (which is half of Israel total defense budget by comparison)
Sure, Israel has an enormous advantage for now.
But the concern is that Iran is building a nuke production infrastructure much bigger than Israel has and in 15 years Iran may have more.And 200 Hiroshimas for example on Israel is end of Israel but not end of Iran even they would need 30 years to recover.

2.The 200 plus Israeli atomic devices are unstoppable by Iran i.e. up to 80 can be launched by submarines and the rest by ICBM or F-15s or F-16s
Israel has no ICBM but IRBM. 80 launched by submarine is a little bit optimistic (LOL)

3.Israel has the world?s most advanced anti-ICBM missle umbrella which may be impenetrable by Iranian Shahib missles . Iran can only deliver their 1-2 atomic warheads by ICBMs with no other delivery capabilities.
Are you laughing?Israel anti missile umbrella is not anti ICBM but anti IRBM and is far away and below of what US have and less advanced.No DSP satellites for Israel for example.Moreover Israeli system can be quite easily outnumbered by installing decoys on IRBM.

4.Israel has a satellite system with multiple types of spy satellites which have reached the limit of possible resolution (defraction limit) generally thought to be about 10 centimeters and their satellite system is all weather. Together with their advanced UAV capabilities , this allows Israel to possess the most detailed photos and real-time imaging of all Iranian military installations . 
By no way possible: Israel don't have 10 centimeters resolution satellite or all weather radar satellite capabilities.Do you have any idea of weight of high resolution satellites and the cost of such an infrastructure? Obviously not.Israel hads probably 1 m visible resolution satellites of few hundred kg at most.Which is very good for such a country.

5.The military technologic difference between Israel and Iran is wide.
Yes for now and the coming decade.

Israel has about 10% of the world-wide arms export market which based solely on merit and immensely competitive.
 And a huge leverage on US help in technology and funding.And not many moral consideration when selling weapons.I understand them however.

IF anything, it is nothing short of a miracle and a tremendous tribute to Israel (jewish ) expertise that they sell to so many countries which never take the side of Israel in any dispute. There are those ,who imply much of Israel?s technological edge is due to massive American aid.
Of course it is.Do you know engineering manpower of Israel and funding?
USA spend more than 7 billions $ annually only for defense basic technology.Do you think Israel has the budget might to fund research on  all defense technology fields? To fund costly specific advanced plants for all advanced components and materials?Israel do not have a MMIC foundry for example for radar components.

However, that aid also has restrained the development of Israeli military technology. American military contractors regularly and understandably, attempt to undermine Israeli sale of military technology when it is in direct competition with American contractors? efforts to sell abroad.
 
Quote    Reply

french stratege       10/23/2009 5:33:43 AM
Typo error
Read
They can not use more than a small fraction of their air power against Iran while Iran has means to bomb them with IRBM and using terrorism and Hezbollah.
Now it is granted that Isreal has much more advanced military means.And no strategic depth.
 
Quote    Reply

Arcasi       12/16/2009 12:46:25 PM
Iran is a strong country but Iran has lots of enemies.Israel is strong country too.Israel would defeat Iran desicively because if war breaks out between Israel and Iran USA will declare war on Iran.I think Iran has to change their politica
 
Quote    Reply

gandolf       12/17/2009 11:46:26 AM
the thinking is that israel will just take out irans nuke sites is wrong ...i think thats way off ..
 In the first hour of an israeli or american attack iran will have no power or comunications no aircraft no offencive or defencive capabities and thats just after the first hour , iran will have used up all its anti aircraft capabilties allowing israel or and the usa to bomb iran over and over and over hour after hour , Israel will be able to fly to iran and back unhindered for days russia and the chinese will have to go to the UN to save Iran .
the missles that iran has could be hit in the israeli first strike as you know these missles will be a priority as the nuke sites are not going anywhere so israel must think out its 400 targets an hour wisly.
 
 
 
 
 
Quote    Reply

pismopal       12/18/2009 6:28:19 PM
You are correct about Israel attacking more than Irans nuke sites. Israel must take out all of Irans war making ability including command and control and decision makers at the highest level....first. In fact the nuke sites are lower on the target list than the command structure. Israels war making abilities are going to be stretched but the longer they wait, the greater the stretch.  The first side to strike wins.
 
Quote    Reply

gandolf       12/19/2009 7:31:13 AM
if israel goes it alone it could be rough , but when the bombs fall in iran and the phone and power dont work and everyone is looking for someone to take charge that creats chaos , do it during the working day when everyone is at work people running around trying to get their kids from school more chaos cell phones dont work and overload of the basic systems.
Iran will strike out using everything she has and iran will attack usa bases as they are closer to israel and they have more short range rockets than long range , most of thier rockets are liquid and have to be fulled before firing the fuel is like jp-5 even a spark can set it off so it must be stored in tanks and constanly circulated, iran has less then a handfull of solid rockets .
so it makes more sence to attack usa bases and shipe then israel , iran can only hope that syria or lebonen will help them .
thats not likly with syria but hizballah might try something .
 
I think Israel has 12 to 48 hours to do its worst to iran before the chinese and russian and the muslim world demand israel/usa  to stop. I would not be surprised if the europians would not be on board as they have to worry about their large and growing muslim comunities. israel should take out Irans oil fields so iran can be turned into a poor country not just for 10 years but maybe 100 cant build an army selling pistachio nuts . 
by taking out irans oil feilds china will hurt big time and europe beibng no friend with israel will feel the pain as well .
just my thoughts while smoking a J : )) shalom
 
Quote    Reply
1 2 3 4 5 6 7   NEXT



 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics