Military History | How To Make War | Wars Around the World Rules of Use How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Submarines Discussion Board
   Return to Topic Page
Subject: Something I read about the state of US underwater warfare............
Herald1234    11/28/2006 1:16:29 PM
http://newton.nap.edu/books/0309069262/html "http://newton.nap.edu/books/0309069262/html" [quoting in particular] In 1995 the Department of Defense, in concert with the Navy, made the decision to phase out torpedo production, saying that there was no foreseen need and that the industrial base could be reconstituted quickly. In terms of programming, that decision is 10 years old. Development of a completely new torpedo is at the least a 15-year process (probably more like 20 years, given the defunct status of the industrial base for making new torpedoes and the Navy acquisition bureaucracy; see Box 1.1).3 If the Navy is to begin gearing up for new torpedo development, or more appropriately, for undersea weapons development, it should be starting a major technology assessment and development effort within the present Future Year Defense Program. There are no signs, however, that such an effort is forthcoming. The country could lose its long-held competence in torpedoes. This state of affairs is the result of several factors: The absence of new torpedo development programs; A reduction in inventories; Minimal or inadequate fleet firings and in-service tests; Proliferation of offshore torpedo technologies, including countermeasures, that are approaching par with existing U.S. technologies; Export prohibitions that preclude U.S. industries from competing for international business; and Inadequate investment in S&T against future need. Industry, which was such a strong player in the past, no longer has an incentive to maintain its competence or infrastructure or to invest in its own research and development (R&D). Funds for 6.4, once robust, are no longer available to stimulate and advance technology. Perishable human expertise and know-how in this unique weapons field are rapidly disappearing. Additionally, the prospect of being unable to compete in the international arms market because of draconian export constraints is a disincentive for industry. Industry is further removed as a participant since most Navy S&T funds are spent in-house. Inventory reductions are leading to a ?platinum bullet? syndrome: the belief that torpedoes are too rare and precious to waste on low-confidence targets, which will as a result linger as clutter in the battle space unless classified and eliminated. Torpedo firings during fleet exercises are dangerously low (<2 percent of inventory), and the inventory is not being adequately tested or cycled. The need to thoroughly test torpedoes is well established: inadequate testing of torpedoes before World War II resulted in weapons that failed in combat, with catastrophic consequences. The committee is concerned that history may repeat itself. The end of the Cold War has unfettered European Community and former Soviet bloc arms manufacturers. They are now offering torpedoes, countermeasures, and undersea warfare systems to any buyer. These technologies (at least on paper) appear comparable to or better than anything the United States could now offer. At the present rate of S&T investment (the only source of undersea weapons upgrades), U.S. systems will fall behind. The prospect of this situation makes S &T investment more urgent than ever. Funding for Navy S&T is all that maintains U.S. competence in undersea weapons, and it is inadequate. _______________________________________________ That was as of FY 2000. I don't know if the Bush Administration did anything adequate to reverse that sad state of affairs. I note with interest [sarcasm] that the previous administration thought it was a good idea to scrap the torpedo industrial base. What is it with these idiots? Herald
 
Quote    Reply

Show Only Poster Name and Title     Newest to Oldest
Galrahn       11/28/2006 6:24:36 PM
 
The US is partnered with Australia for Torpedo development. Most of the news out of the US goes unnoticed, but the Aussie's tend to give better details anyway.
 
 
That article has information on development of the MK 48 Mod 7, the US currently fields the MK 48 Mod 5 and MK 48 Mod 6, while the Aussies currently field the MK 48 Mod 4.
 
During the cold war, a common complaint of US sub skippers was they had great subs, but terrible weapons. Today, the US has great weapons, but fewer platforms to use them from.
 
Quote    Reply

EW3       11/28/2006 7:53:21 PM
Any thought to the ADCAP being deployed from non-sub platforms/locations? 
 
 
Quote    Reply

stingray1003       11/28/2006 8:24:16 PM
Mod 7 test firing should take place in 2007.
 
Australia and the US seem to be very keen on getting these. They now both will run the same Combat systems.
 
 
Collins should then have the same capabilities (bar underwater endurance) as the most modern US boats.
 
 Does not look like they are going to be used on platforms other than submarines, just yet anyway. They seem to be specifically upgraded for use in submarines, against other submarines.  
 
Quote    Reply

EW3       11/28/2006 8:56:51 PM
We also have the MK-54 Mod(0) as well.   
When/if the HAAWC works out, even a Predator becomes a sub killer.    
 
 
Quote    Reply

Herald1234    I've got mine warfare on the brain.   11/28/2006 9:01:48 PM

We also have the MK-54 Mod(0) as well.   

When/if the HAAWC works out, even a Predator becomes a sub killer.    

 

How good is HAAWC at delivering mines?

Herald
 
Quote    Reply

EW3       11/28/2006 9:45:59 PM

As Sgt Schultz would say "I know nothing!",  but since the MK-46 was the "mine" in the CAPTOR, I would suspect the MK-54, which is it's descendant in shape and size, might be capable of being a "mine".


How good is HAAWC at delivering mines?

Herald


 
Quote    Reply

gf0012-aust       11/28/2006 10:12:37 PM


As Sgt Schultz would say "I know nothing!",  but since the MK-46 was the "mine" in the CAPTOR, I would suspect the MK-54, which is it's descendant in shape and size, might be capable of being a "mine".



well, if all they do is replace the warhead with a mine - and as long as they keep the electronics modules - then it would be one hell of a mine.
the processing power and on board database is better than that on some warships....
 
Quote    Reply

EW3       11/28/2006 10:15:44 PM
so skip the engine?    Just the front end? 
 
 
Quote    Reply



 Latest
 News
 
 Most
 Read
 
 Most
 Commented
 Hot
 Topics