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Subject: NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS
LJ813    7/1/2005 9:34:17 PM
I WILL GO FOR THE NAVY..
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/17/2006 10:19:34 PM
Mough, >>what DEVGRU can or can not do in relation to CAG is something you don't know, don't mean to be harsh, but there is a reason why CAG is the number 1 tier 1 unit, just like the SAS andSBS, size matter's and CAG can do thing's DEVGRU can't.<< First of all, it doesn't bother me if any of you are 'harsh' to me...I am here to learn from you guys (bet you didn't know that :). Secondly, I had no idea that there was a ranking of tier 1 units...CAG as the best tier 1 unit? Horsesoldier, >>But, reality, I don't buy it. It is, as you've said, situational and such (different individuals and small units have different strengths and weaknesses), but I've heard one too many stories about SEALs doing very silly things with firearms (i.e. thinking they narrowly escaped death because they kept shooting the metal sling loops on the hood of a humvee accidentally because of bore-line/optics issues during a gun fight and thought the bad guys were lighting them up due to the bullets spalling off the loops right in front of them . . .) to be willing to give them any status as superior shooters.<< Yes, but you have never been around SEALs, you have never been at the shooting range with SEALs, and have never been at a shooting range with both SEALs and SF to compare (neither have I...my arguments are based on nothing but what I have read). I gaurantee you that there are an equal number of bad stories about SF as there are about SEALs...you just don't hear about them because you are an Army guy. This is THE most ridiculous thread on the forum. it has gone from Navy SEALS vs SAS to SEALs suck, to Devgru is the best, to they are all good, to SF is the baddest SOBS on the planet, to here. I am putting an end to this SEAL/SF, Devgru/CAG (hopefully) with some basic facts: Fact 1: SEALs are combat swimmer first, land warfare second. Their mission set is primarily Combat swimming. They are frogmen who can shoot and navigate very well. Fact 2: SF's realm is almost strictly land. They ought to be better at Land warfare. Fact 3: Devgru's mission set is close to the regular SEAL Teams. Fact 4: CAG mission set is similar to SF's. Statement 1: I would rather have a SEAL Team taking down an OPLAT or Ship than SF or CAG. Statement 2: I would rather have CAG take down Ahmadinijeads (SP) house than Devgru. Statement 3: I would rather have Devgru take down Ahmadinijeads boat than CAG. Statement 4: I would rather have SF train, equip, and lead the Iranian anti-Mullah force into battle. --------------------------------- Guys, all of these units have different mission sets/tasks. They are all EXTREMELY good at their ENTIRE mission set...probably the best in the world. I can assure you that SEALs can run and shoot equal to the other SOCOM forces, but swim better. All of the SOCOM guys can ran and shoot extremely well (if SOCOM held a contest between units, it would probably be extremely close). The things that make a SOF unit succesful are the following: Quality of men and training Quality of leadership Quality of equipment The way they are utilized At the level we are talking about, everyone is good...but it is usually based around the number of deployments (which indicates experience level). Horsesoldier thinks that SEALs can't handle land warfare...well, I would rather have a SEAL with 4-5 deployments under his belt than a SF soldier with 1 deployment under his belt...and vice versa. We are dealing with people here (at this high of level), not the SEALs or SF...people. That is all I have to say :)
 
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Horsesoldier    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/18/2006 8:08:27 AM
>>your kidding?......that's keystone cop's level stuff. << I wasn't there, but that's the way I heard it from an operator who was there . . .
 
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mough    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/18/2006 10:54:09 AM
First of all, it doesn't bother me if any of you are 'harsh' to me...I am here to learn from you guys (bet you didn't know that :). Secondly, I had no idea that there was a ranking of tier 1 units...CAG as the best tier 1 unit?< good, your mature then ;), ranking would imply one is better then the other, you will never hear me say that, my point is, that CAG is the go to tier 1 unit that the US government look's to when the brown stuff hit's the fan, after the problem's in Iran in 1980 when every branch wanted into the rescue, it was decided that 1 unit would be responsible for that mission from now on, that unit was SFOD-D, no more marine/sailors/ect coming along, and from then on when ever something happened, from the hunt for Pablo Escobar to most of the more sensitive op's in Pakistan ect ect, it's been CAG, that's not to say DEVGRU can't do them, it,s just they are not looked on as favorably as the CAG by certain elements, this is slowly changing though, but it's alway's going to be a situation similar to the SAS/SBS one,
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/18/2006 9:49:12 PM
>>I wasn't there, but that's the way I heard it from an operator who was there . . . << That is a pretty funny story. I am sure that the SEAL who managed that brilliant shooting probably has a plaque with his name on it :). Mough, I agree that CAG is the go to unit. They have done an excellent job on almost all ops...I hate to point this out, because I don't know if it is supposed to be known, but CAG performed ops in Pakistan? Serious question: What are your thoughts on the SEALs and Devgru? I might have asked you this before, but what is your view on them. Also, don't want any specifics (of course), but have you ever worked with SEALs or CAG?
 
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mough    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/21/2006 7:50:31 AM
Mough, I agree that CAG is the go to unit. They have done an excellent job on almost all ops...I hate to point this out, because I don't know if it is supposed to be known, but CAG performed ops in Pakistan?>> ok, certain military unit's have carried out op's there, it's a badly kept secret, and a badly kept secret, is not a secret anymore.....confusing?
 
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mough    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/21/2006 7:55:37 AM
Serious question: What are your thoughts on the SEALs and Devgru? I might have asked you this before, but what is your view on them. Also, don't want any specifics (of course), but have you ever worked with SEALs or CAG?<< my thought's?....I'm not going to get into a who's more highspeed discussion, but they both do their job's to the best of their abilities, personelly I like SEAL's, yes they like the personel grooming side of thing's alot more then we do, and they use enough hairgel that the sun shines off their head's, but good guy's all the same, I can't/won't get into detail on what they do, and yes I have with the SEAL's once or twice, about CAG I couldn't tell, they are so sneaky, I could have, and never known it :)
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS - Ehran   5/21/2006 1:21:09 PM
>>my thought's?....I'm not going to get into a who's more highspeed discussion<< I am glad, don't really like those kind of discussions. >> I like SEAL's, yes they like the personel grooming side of thing's alot more then we do, and they use enough hairgel that the sun shines off their head's, but good guy's all the same, I can't/won't get into detail on what they do, and yes I have with the SEAL's once or twice, about CAG I couldn't tell, they are so sneaky, I could have, and never known it :)<< >> I like SEAL's, yes they like the personel grooming side of thing's alot more then we do, and they use enough hairgel that the sun shines off their head's, but good guy's all the same, I can't/won't get into detail on what they do, and yes I have with the SEAL's once or twice, about CAG I couldn't tell, they are so sneaky, I could have, and never known it :)<< That is kind of what I was looking for, just curious if they were as bad a Horsesoldier said. Also, I never want any specific details about any SOF units (well, US/Coalition units...basically the good guys) because the internet is definitely not the place for any specifics at all (neither is anywhere else in the civilian world, really). Thanks for the info.
 
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stratbert    The Final Word to GOP   5/22/2006 1:33:57 AM
GOP. The unfounded, hearsay, "hey i havent worked with SEALs but I heard this..." attitude againt the Teams that pervade this forum is the direct result of one thing...professional jealousy. End of story. You other knuckleheads want to run your suck...say it to a guy with a Trident, in person. That is all.
 
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Yimmy    RE:The Final Word to GOP   5/22/2006 5:39:49 AM
"say it to a guy with a Trident, in person" Well, Tridents as a unit badge are not unique to the SEALs.
 
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mough    RE:The Final Word to GOP   5/22/2006 6:15:54 AM
GOP. The unfounded, hearsay, "hey i havent worked with SEALs but I heard this..." attitude againt the Teams that pervade this forum is the direct result of one thing...professional jealousy. End of story. You other knuckleheads want to run your suck...say it to a guy with a Trident, in person. That is all.<< I once got into a water balloon fight with a bunch of guy's with trident's...not so tough ;)
 
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