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Subject: F-35 vs. Eurofighter
IAFbestinworld    8/13/2004 11:49:07 PM
Lockheed says that besides the f-22, the f-35 will be the best air to air fighter in the future, is this true? Could an f-35 take a Eurofighter? My opinion says yes since f-35 contains more stealthy characteristics.
 
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Professor Fickle    Can it replace the A-10 thunderblot?????????   10/10/2005 3:32:55 PM
Can the JSF replace the A-10? my opinion HEEELLLLLLLLLLLL NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! Any Opposing Opinions? Assume SAM have bin destroyed. What would you rather have for Close Air Support JSF or A-10
 
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displacedjim    RE:Can it replace the A-10 thunderblot?????????   10/11/2005 12:28:40 PM
It won't need to. We're upgrading the A-10 and keeping 150 of them out to 2028. Displacedjim
 
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perfectgeneral    RE:Can it replace the A-10 thunderblot?????????   10/11/2005 4:57:43 PM
If it's all the same to you I'd sooner not assume that all SAM have been destroyed. I'd rather have a flying tank than a flying hiding place for low level work, but with good sensors and targeting ground attack need not be low level.
 
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skrip00    RE:F/A-22 & F/A-35 Hi-Lo mix again?   10/12/2005 4:47:53 PM
Is it safe to say the F/A-22 and F/A-35 are just the next generation of Hi-Lo mix? Just like the F-15 and F-16, or F-14 and F/A-18? The F/A-35 (as it should be called mind you) seems to have more internal fuel and range than the aircraft its replacing. IE the F-16, F/A-18C~D, and the AV-8B. Not to mention its stealth characteristics and sensor suite are also a great advantage. The more important feature of both the -22 and -35 is the fact that they were designed with long lifespans in mind. Designed to take in modular upgrades to electronics, sensors, and even possibly airframe. So, now that the US has its future Hi-Lo mix ready to rock, what is the european response? It seems to me they lack any real heavy fighters, or a Hi-Lo mix. Would they ever pair up the Eurofighter and Rafale? It seems like a good mix. The EF being a good air to air plane and the Rafale geared more towards bomb-hauling. Will the EUAF ever work out a deal along those lines?
 
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Yimmy    RE:F/A-22 & F/A-35 Hi-Lo mix again?   10/12/2005 7:01:28 PM
Well, for the UK it looks like it will be along the lines of Eurofighter Typhoon Air-Air, and F35 air-ground.
 
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aero engineer    RE:French strategic and jsf?   11/9/2005 6:12:30 PM
Shooter, your warped sense of how superior American fighters are is sickening. Yes, US fighers outperform their european counterparts, but not sooo much so that their planes are worthless. The eurofighter, rafale, or gripen would give any F-15/16/18 a difficult time, and may even succeed in downing the american plane, depending on the conditions of course. When comparing fighters and which would win in a dogfight, one of the least important factors is MTOW. So what if the F-15 is bigger, heavier, and can carry more payload than a F-16. A F-16 still CAN shoot down a F-15. It only takes 1 missle hit to down any plane. More importantly is thrust-to-weight ratio, which directly affects the plane's specific excess power (which relates to its maneuverability and ability to acelerate). Oh, btw the F-16 doesn't have a thrust-to-weight ratio close to 1.06. The only "4th generation" fighter (F-15,16,18, etc) with a T/W ratio of over 1 is the F-15 and its ratio is 1.04. The F-15's Eagle's T/W ratio greater than 1 is what allowed it to break several time to climb records; feel free to look them up in the guiness book of world records. The F-16's T/W ratio is closer to 0.6 if I recall correctly, and the F-18's is like 0.5. Another error in your statements is that F-15,16,18 have high-bypass turbofans. . . that's simply WRONG. All those fighters have low-bypass turbofans. Turbofans are considered low-bypass if their bypass ratio is anything under 1-1.5, the F404 and F100 have bypass ratios around 0.35. A high bypass turbofan is any engine with a bypass ratio over 4 or so. Oh and the F-18 is not that great of a plane. The navy really should've picked the YF-17 instead of the F-18. At least they're making up for that mistake now with the JSF. The F-18's biggest shortcoming is its short range compared to the planes it replaced. The F-18's put the carrier groups at much higher risks. They forced the Navy to revise policies and move carriers closer to land so that F-18s could reach targets that were decently inland. Also the F/A-18's landing speed is much higher than any carrier plane that came before it, even faster than the big F-4. What ultimately helps US pilots consistently win air-to-air battles is pilot training. The U.S. military has all the sophiscated computer simulations, and the numerous planes for pilots to practice in. Next to the Israeli pilots there aren't many pilots better than the United States's. A good example would be how the Mig-15 was vastly superior to the American F-86 Sabre, yet the United States kept a fairly decent win-loss record in air combat. Next time shooter, do some REAL research before posting. P.S. Please Shooter!!! Learn how to spell!!!
 
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Phaid    RE:French strategic and jsf?   11/10/2005 11:34:27 AM
Oh, btw the F-16 doesn't have a thrust-to-weight ratio close to 1.06. The only "4th generation" fighter (F-15,16,18, etc) with a T/W ratio of over 1 is the F-15 and its ratio is 1.04. The F-15's Eagle's T/W ratio greater than 1 is what allowed it to break several time to climb records; feel free to look them up in the guiness book of world records. The F-16's T/W ratio is closer to 0.6 if I recall correctly, and the F-18's is like 0.5. You really should check your facts. The F-16C Block 52 (clean, full internal fuel only) has a dry t/w of 0.69 and a afterburning t/w of 1.11. (Weight Empty 19,200 lbs; Internal Fuel 6,972 lbs; AB thrust 29,000 lbs). Likewise, your F/A-18 numbers are way off; the F/A-18E/F's F414 engines produce a total of 29540 lbs dry thrust and 44,000 lbs afterburning thrust. This means a dry thrust to weight of 0.65 and afterburning 0.98. The legacy hornets have about the same t/w. This isn't to say that Shooter's posts aren't also full of factual inaccuracies of course, but it's important to get your own facts straight before calling someone else's.
 
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DarthAmerica    RE:French strategic and jsf?   11/10/2005 1:11:29 PM
>>>Oh and the F-18 is not that great of a plane.<<< ---Trememdous BS. The F-18 will go into aviation history as one of the greatest planes of all time. Do you realise how much of a burden is shouldered by F-18s? Do you not understand that next to the F-22 the current block of F-18Es are the most advanced planes in the world and based on the evolution of a combat proven design? I cant even believe you would write that statement and expect to be taken seriously.
 
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Crystal Phallus    RE:French strategic and jsf?   11/10/2005 8:39:44 PM
Jesus, my PC blew up 6 months ago, I finally get back online and this thread is STILL going. Still, nice to see nothing has changed, "The F18E is the most advanced plane in the world after the F22?" Must be news to all those people that have been bitching like hell about it being a retrograde step from the F14. That's a hell of a sweeping statement isn't it? If it's that good why not bin the Raptor, get the USAF to buy F18's and sweep the skies clear of enemy fighters? I can't believe that you would make that statement and expect to be taken seriously.
 
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DropBear    RE:French strategic and jsf? - DA   11/11/2005 2:05:12 AM
Do you not understand that next to the F-22 the current block of F-18Es are the most advanced planes in the world and based on the evolution of a combat proven design? Goodluck trying to get the anti-Hornet infidels to accept what some of us already appreciate. ;)
 
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