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Subject: See If This Works
CJH    5/21/2010 4:30:30 PM
David Barton of Wallbuilders http://www.youtube.com/v/OdhWitlgkd0&hl=en_US&fs=1&">http://www.youtube.com/v/OdhWitlgkd0&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"> http://www.youtube.com/v/bYMjjb8syu4&hl=en_US&fs=1&">http://www.youtube.com/v/bYMjjb8syu4&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"> http://www.youtube.com/v/XMU1v4-oPBo&hl=en_US&fs=1&">http://www.youtube.com/v/XMU1v4-oPBo&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"> http://www.youtube.com/v/DF1myzMgUa0&hl=en_US&fs=1&">http://www.youtube.com/v/DF1myzMgUa0&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"> http://www.youtube.com/v/eBHXdnRJOXk&hl=en_US&fs=1&">http://www.youtube.com/v/eBHXdnRJOXk&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385">
 
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CJH       5/21/2010 4:36:03 PM
I referenced this video before. These embeds link to YouTube copies of the video in segments.
 
David Barton mentions Alexis de Toqueville's "Democracy in America"
 
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CJH       5/21/2010 4:49:31 PM
Also InTouch.org Video Archives, 2009, November
 
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CJH       5/21/2010 4:56:23 PM
I'm putting this up here because I believe this presentation goes to the core of our dilemma today.
 
Whether or not we return to the nation's roots determines whether or not civilization survives here.
 
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YelliChink       5/21/2010 5:11:32 PM
Tell that to Atheist Communist Litigation Unit and their friends in the current administration, who apparently have problem with a cross in a national monument for commemoration of US soldiers that no others have a problem with.
 
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CJH       5/21/2010 5:58:54 PM

Tell that to Atheist Communist Litigation Unit and their friends in the current administration, who apparently have problem with a cross in a national monument for commemoration of US soldiers that no others have a problem with.

I just remind myself that God is in control and that He takes care of His own and then I see, regarding those people, that this too shall pass away.
 
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earlm       5/21/2010 10:03:52 PM



Tell that to Atheist Communist Litigation Unit and their friends in the current administration, who apparently have problem with a cross in a national monument for commemoration of US soldiers that no others have a problem with.




I just remind myself that God is in control and that He takes care of His own and then I see, regarding those people, that this too shall pass away.


IMO the wrong attitude.  I posted a video in another thread that shows the problem.  We need to be active to insure that we don't end up in a moral relativist cesspool.  Note that there are atheists like Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens who are against the post modernist garbage.  Dawkins actually seems to be more afraid of the nihilist post modernists than he is of religion.  The real battle is people who have values and are willing to judge that A is better than B against people who want everything to be equal, not just incomes.  In that system we can make no value judgements lest someone be judged as less than another.  It means the end of civilization.
 
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CJH       5/23/2010 3:50:47 PM
I believe that most reasonable people can accept that it is possible for A to be better than B or vice-versa. After all, we all have to draw such conclusions on a mundane level in day-to-day life.
 
The problem with having some people doing the judging is that then you are going to have conflicting judgings by different judges. Then, how do you tell who is right and who is wrong.
 
That gets to assume, somewhat, the same liabilities which attach to having every individual define right and wrong for himself. That's because there will be conflicts between different views which conflicts are going inevitably to have to be resolved through force.
 
Such a situation as that would mean that people would be essentially ungovernable except under a despotism. Giving them freedom would lead to a total loss of social cooperation.
 
What I am recommending is that we can and should agree on what God judges as right and wrong as represented in His revelation, the Bible. That seems to be how our country got started as it did.
 
It offers us a basis for social cooperation for which government compulsion is unnecessary. Every civilization needs to be governed by law. The more of that governing law that is internalized in its people (as God's law), the more free its people.
 
 
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Aussiegunneragain       5/24/2010 8:41:09 AM

The problem with having some people doing the judging is that then you are going to have conflicting judgings by different judges. Then, how do you tell who is right and who is wrong. 
 

The answer from my undergraduate philosphy lecturer is that there are some self evident truths that all successful philosphical traditions must share in order to prosper for any length of time. So long as we accept the basic tenants of good living like doing no harm (at least) and doing good (better still) then we can usually work out any differences in a positive way, or at least find a fair way to make a decision even when it doesn't suit everybody. Stephen Covey, a committed Mormon but also the author of one of the most secular self help books of all time "The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" extensively studied the great philosphical traditions, both religious and secular, and drew much the same conclusion. The basics for social co-operation are there in all of those belief systems, even if there are times when they are not practiced by the adherants.
 
In contrast people who try to find difference for whatever screwed up reason and make an issue of it will only every destroy happiness. Christianity proved that with the incessent fighting between Protestants and Catholics which lasted for centuries after the Reformation, only finally ending (hopefully) with the end of the troubles in Ireland. How did God's law help to create peace on those conflicts? Athiests like Dawkins are as bad. He is another one who cannot live and let live, and finds the need to attack peoples beliefs, even when they are quite happy to mind their own business. The Soviets had a lot like him and look at how many people died because of it.
 
The true secret to spiritual and social harmony is to live by the universal truths and to refute any person or group that does not.

 
 
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WarNerd       5/25/2010 3:17:04 AM


The problem with having some people doing the judging is that then you are going to have conflicting judgings by different judges. Then, how do you tell who is right and who is wrong.  

The answer from my undergraduate philosphy lecturer is that there are some self evident truths that all successful philosphical traditions must share in order to prosper for any length of time. So long as we accept the basic tenants of good living like doing no harm (at least) and doing good (better still) then we can usually work out any differences in a positive way, or at least find a fair way to make a decision even when it doesn't suit everybody. Stephen Covey, a committed Mormon but also the author of one of the most secular self help books of all time "The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" extensively studied the great philosphical traditions, both religious and secular, and drew much the same conclusion. The basics for social co-operation are there in all of those belief systems, even if there are times when they are not practiced by the adherants.
 
In contrast people who try to find difference for whatever screwed up reason and make an issue of it will only every destroy happiness. Christianity proved that with the incessent fighting between Protestants and Catholics which lasted for centuries after the Reformation, only finally ending (hopefully) with the end of the troubles in Ireland. How did God's law help to create peace on those conflicts? Athiests like Dawkins are as bad. He is another one who cannot live and let live, and finds the need to attack peoples beliefs, even when they are quite happy to mind their own business. The Soviets had a lot like him and look at how many people died because of it.

The true secret to spiritual and social harmony is to live by the universal truths and to refute any person or group that does not.

Hate to break this to you, but the core of modern politics is to embrace the later while denying the existance of the former.
 
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Aussiegunneragain       5/25/2010 5:15:19 AM





The problem with having some people doing the judging is that then you are going to have conflicting judgings by different judges. Then, how do you tell who is right and who is wrong.  




The answer from my undergraduate philosphy lecturer is that there are some self evident truths that all successful philosphical traditions must share in order to prosper for any length of time. So long as we accept the basic tenants of good living like doing no harm (at least) and doing good (better still) then we can usually work out any differences in a positive way, or at least find a fair way to make a decision even when it doesn't suit everybody. Stephen Covey, a committed Mormon but also the author of one of the most secular self help books of all time "The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" extensively studied the great philosphical traditions, both religious and secular, and drew much the same conclusion. The basics for social co-operation are there in all of those belief systems, even if there are times when they are not practiced by the adherants.


 

In contrast people who try to find difference for whatever screwed up reason and make an issue of it will only every destroy happiness. Christianity proved that with the incessent fighting between Protestants and Catholics which lasted for centuries after the Reformation, only finally ending (hopefully) with the end of the troubles in Ireland. How did God's law help to create peace on those conflicts? Athiests like Dawkins are as bad. He is another one who cannot live and let live, and finds the need to attack peoples beliefs, even when they are quite happy to mind their own business. The Soviets had a lot like him and look at how many people died because of it.



The true secret to spiritual and social harmony is to live by the universal truths and to refute any person or group that does not.




Hate to break this to you, but the core of modern politics is to embrace the later while denying the existance of the former.


Only for mediocre to poor leaders. Unfortunately there are a lot of them but fortunately the great ones have a disproportionate impact.
 
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