Military History
|
How To Make War
|
Wars Around the World
Rules of Use
How to Behave on an Internet Forum
Israel
Discussion Board
Return to Topic Page
Subject:
Willy Pete
kensohaski
1/24/2009 7:30:39 AM
I understand that using it against civilians is a no-no... Is the State of Israel using this stuff against Hamas?
Quote
Reply
Show Only Poster Name and Title
Newest to Oldest
WarNerd
1/24/2009 9:26:39 PM
Who knows?
We have pictures of Israeli smoke shells bursting at altitude (which appear to be M825 equivalents) with streamers of smoke decending to ground level and the initial stages of the formation of a smoke screen. But so far I have not seen any video that documents any secondary fires at any of the locations.
We have reports and photos of a few "unusual burns", but nothing to confirm that they were caused by phosphorus.
Even if we can confirm all of the above, it still does not indicate a deliberate act. Undoubtedly several hundred (thousand?) smoke shells have been fired, the odds are at least a few had defective fuses and ejected their contents after impacting the ground. I do not know the latest statistics, but possibly more than 1% of the rounds fired could detonate late.
So basically we have a lot of press and noise, but no proof.
Quote
Reply
AdvanceAustralia
1/25/2009 4:11:33 AM
I understand that using it against civilians is a no-no... Is the State of Israel using this stuff against Hamas?
Hamas cannot be considered civilian - by their own choice they are combatants. Enemy combatants.
The International Red Cross (a far more credible organisation than those continually accusing Israel of war crimes) has said it has no evidence of illegal use of WP by Israel.
I long ago stopped believing the propaganda headlines about Israel's supposed war crimes. Remember Mohammad Al Dura.
Cheers.
Quote
Reply
jastayme3
1/26/2009 1:33:31 PM
We use the word "illegal" to often with regard to war. No State can be expected to
be restrained merely by treaty when it's own security is at stake and in any case the word
"illegal" can easily be interpreted as an insult to sovereignity. It also implies that a treaty is the same as a
law when it is not even quite the same as a civil contract(as contract law assumes a court that one can appeal two
which has the power to enforce it's decisions).. Why not use old categories instead?
It is just as easy to say WP is "unchivalrous", or "dishonorable" then to say it is illegal.
As a footnote, I don't think Israel uses WP on real civilians. And I don't give a hoot if it uses them on it's enemies..
Quote
Reply
swhitebull
1/26/2009 2:33:40 PM
We use the word "illegal" to often with regard to war. No State can be expected to
be restrained merely by treaty when it's own security is at stake and in any case the word
"illegal" can easily be interpreted as an insult to sovereignity. It also implies that a treaty is the same as a
law when it is not even quite the same as a civil contract(as contract law assumes a court that one can appeal two
which has the power to enforce it's decisions).. Why not use old categories instead?
It is just as easy to say WP is "unchivalrous", or "dishonorable" then to say it is illegal.
As a footnote, I don't think Israel uses WP on real civilians. And I don't give a hoot if it uses them on it's enemies..
Nothing like Hamasholes being turned into crispy critters.
swhitebull - of course, if a Grad rocket hit an israeli school filled with kids, the world press would just dismiss it. I really dont give a f-xzz what the world thinks of Israel's actions at this point.
Quote
Reply
Latest
News
Most
Read
Most
Commented
Hot
Topics
WEAPONS: Unjammable Wire Controlled UAVs
RUSSIA: Russia Claims a Lot More Than Ukraine
ARMOR: Russia Rebuilds Its Tank Forces
ARTILLERY: Fire Weaver and Long Spike
ARMOR: Evolution of Tank Warfare in Ukraine
SURFACE FORCES : Ada Class Corvettes
ARMOR: Evolution of Tank Warfare in Ukraine
WEAPONS: Putting a Spike in North Korean Aggression
AIR WEAPONS: The Ukraine Unmanned Systems Force
PROCUREMENT: The Russian Smuggling Industry
AFGHANISTAN: Afghanistan March 2024
ATTRITION: Patterns of American Combat Casualties
ELECTRONIC WEAPONS: Norway Again Attacked by Russian Jamming
SURFACE FORCES : Unmanned LUSV Ships at Sea
MURPHY'S LAW: China Harasses Foreign Investment it Encouraged
PROCUREMENT: Russian Demand and North Korean Arms Production
PROCUREMENT: Russian Demand and North Korean Arms Production
WARPLANES: F22 Gets an End Date
ARTILLERY: More Truck Mounted Artillery for Ukraine
SPACE: Russian Roscosmos Retreating
INTELLIGENCE: Americans Use AI to Plan Airstrikes
SPACE: Russian Roscosmos Retreating
ARTILLERY: More Truck Mounted Artillery for Ukraine
AIR DEFENSE: Russian Air Defense Tries Something New
SUBMARINES: Stumbling Through Submarine Repairs
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: A Decade of CIA Operations in Ukraine
SURFACE FORCES : Despised LCS Survives with Upgrades
SYRIA: Syria March 2024
WARPLANES: F-35 Aircraft in Action
LEADERSHIP: Russia’s Wartime Economic Crisis
Subscribe to Our RSS Feed
Armor: New American M10 Tank
Air Weapons: Western Russia Under Attack
Artillery: Artillery Ammunition Quality and Quantity
Surface Forces: Russian Black Sea Fleet Disappears
WARS China: China Needs South Korea More Than North Korea
Surface Forces: Naval Reload Realities
Air Weapons: Dealing With FPV UAVs
Special Operations: Somali Pirates are Back
Armor: K2 Tanks For Everyone
WARS Russia: Can Russia Continue the War After 2024?
WARS Korea: Korea March 2024
Logistics: The Black Sea Blockade
Procurement: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
Attrition: Russian Losses so Far in Ukraine
Procurement: French Support for Ukraine
NBC Weapons: Chinese Biowar Laboratories in California
ATTRITION: Russian Losses so Far in Ukraine
PROCUREMENT: French Support for Ukraine
ARMOR: New American M10 Tank
AIR WEAPONS: Western Russia Under Attack
ARTILLERY: Artillery Ammunition Quality and Quantity
SURFACE FORCES : Naval Reload Realities
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
ARMOR: K2 Tanks For Everyone
AIR WEAPONS: Dealing With FPV UAVs
SPECIAL OPERATIONS: Somali Pirates are Back
LOGISTICS: The Black Sea Blockade
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
PROCUREMENT: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
KOREA: Korea March 2024
CHINA: China Needs South Korea More Than North Korea
SURFACE FORCES : Russian Black Sea Fleet Disappears
ARTILLERY: Artillery Ammunition Quality and Quantity
Russia: Can Russia Continue the War After 2024?
Russia: Russia Claims a Lot More Than Ukraine
Procurement: French Support for Ukraine
Attrition: Russian Losses so Far in Ukraine
Armor: New American M10 Tank
Warplane Weapons: Western Russia Under Attack
Surface Forces: Naval Reload Realities
Armor: Russia Rebuilds Its Tank Forces
Procurement: Ukraine War Crippled Russian Arms Exports
News
How To Make War
Wars Around The World
Austin Bay's On Point
StrategyTalk
Dirty Little Secrets
Features
Al Nofi's CIC
Videos
Photos
Jokes
Community
Military Discussion Boards
Military Jokes
Military Photos
Military Book Reviews
StrategyPage
Account Manager
Login
Feedback
About Us
Search
Advertise With Us
Search