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Subject: The rise of the Greens, be very scared
Aussiegunneragain    10/18/2008 8:54:45 PM
The Greens tripled their vote in the ACT election last night. I'd put it entirely down to the number of chardonney socialists with more care than responsibility residing here, except that federal election result had the nutters on the rise nationally as well. Even people like my Mum, normally a Liberal voter, are voting for the Greens because she thinks that "those types of people" (i.e. completely idealistic and unreasonable) are important for bringing issues to the fore. Personally I see a place for idealists in lobby groups, but I don't want them having any actual power. Is anybody else wishing that the Australian Democrats had never self destructed and created a vacuam that the Greens have filled? I like the prospect of having a third party with whom I can lodge a protest vote and who can influence the direction of the government, but I'm terrified by the prospect that party being the Greens.
 
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gf0012-aust       10/18/2008 9:07:54 PM


Is anybody else wishing that the Australian Democrats had never self destructed and created a vacuam that the Greens have filled? I like the prospect of having a third party with whom I can lodge a protest vote and who can influence the direction of the government, but I'm terrified by the prospect that party being the Greens.

I lodged a protest vote - but not via the greens.
 
bloody democrats, still, if they couldn't get their house in order then it didn't bode very well for bigger responsibilities.
 

 
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StevoJH       10/19/2008 3:21:19 AM
Rudd pulled out of speaking at our college politics dinner, so now we have Bob Brown coming up instead. ;)
 
Should be interesting......
 
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Aussiegunneragain       10/19/2008 6:58:27 AM





Is anybody else wishing that the Australian Democrats had never self destructed and created a vacuam that the Greens have filled? I like the prospect of having a third party with whom I can lodge a protest vote and who can influence the direction of the government, but I'm terrified by the prospect that party being the Greens.

I lodged a protest vote - but not via the greens.

 bloody democrats, still, if they couldn't get their house in order then it didn't bode very well for bigger responsibilities.

 
The problem with the Democrats was that their constitution was unrealistically democratic. It allowed Little Miss Uni Student Politico Despoja to barrel a bunch of experienced Senators without considering that it is they and not the members that actually hold the seat. Having grassroots involvement is nice but whatever system a party sets up has to realistically allow the leaders to lead, or why would you elect them in the first place?
I voted for a third party too but put the ALP after them on the preferences. Apart from somewhat over-taxing us I don't think that Stanhope has done a terrible job in the ACT and the election is enough like a big council election that I don't really care much about the party politics of it. The Libs campaign was woeful, they didn't even have a policy statement on public finances on their website and they didn't even have anybody giving out how to vote cards at my polling booth. If they can't run a campaign I don't know how they expected to run the Territory.

 
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Aussiegunneragain       10/19/2008 7:01:58 AM

Rudd pulled out of speaking at our college politics dinner, so now we have Bob Brown coming up instead. ;)

 

Should be interesting......



Really? Could you do me a favour and suggest to him (over the mike), that the best contribution that Tassie could make to carbon emissions reduction would be to dam the Franklin in order to generate extra hydro capacity? Please also ensure that you video tape the response for our amusement ;-).
 
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StevoJH       10/19/2008 7:45:40 AM




Rudd pulled out of speaking at our college politics dinner, so now we have Bob Brown coming up instead. ;)



 



Should be interesting......









Really? Could you do me a favour and suggest to him (over the mike), that the best contribution that Tassie could make to carbon emissions reduction would be to dam the Franklin in order to generate extra hydro capacity? Please also ensure that you video tape the response for our amusement ;-).

I'll think about it, though i wasnt even alive back then. ;)
Since i'd actually want to know what i'd be asking about, what power plants are in tassie at the moment with what output? and what was the expected output of the dam?
 
 
Last year we had Tony Windsor up (bit of a change from downer in 2005[before i was here]), this was just after they were making a big deal about Rudd admitting to visiting a New York strip club in the news, so what do you think was the first question asked?
 
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Aussiegunneragain       10/19/2008 8:31:27 AM










Rudd pulled out of speaking at our college politics dinner, so now we have Bob Brown coming up instead. ;)







 







Should be interesting......





















Really? Could you do me a favour and suggest to him (over the mike), that the best contribution that Tassie could make to carbon emissions reduction would be to dam the Franklin in order to generate extra hydro capacity? Please also ensure that you video tape the response for our amusement ;-).




I'll think about it, though i wasnt even alive back then. ;)

Since i'd actually want to know what i'd be asking about, what power plants are in tassie at the moment with what output? and what was the expected output of the dam?

Last year we had Tony Windsor up (bit of a change from downer in 2005[before i was here]), this was just after they were making a big deal about Rudd admitting to visiting a New York strip club in the news, so what do you think was the first question asked?

Currently Hydro Tasmania has 1180 megawatts of hydro generation capacity, with the big five dams having between about 15 and 25 percent of that capacity each. Tassie generates about 5% of the electricity that goes into the National Energy Market and most of that is from hydro. I would presume that assume that a station on the Franklin, being a big river, might increase generate a similar amount to each of these stations, though don't quote me on it because I'm not certain.
 
The important thing about the question is more to see whether BB has the balls to make a compromise when one environmental issue (preservation of the Franklin) is overshadowed by another (e.g. mitigating climate change). This is just one example of where leaders might have to make those sorts of compromises, though it is an interesting one given his personal involvement in the Franklin campaign and presumably emotional attachment to the Franklin. Others examples include deciding whether generating wind power is more important than preserving parrot habitats.
 
Basically its just a public test of whether he is willing to display leadership or whether in fact he is going to be a perpatual lobbyist.

203.2.158.16/home/Corporate/Generating_Power/
 
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Darren Churchill       10/19/2008 9:55:08 AM
Hi,
The Australian Democrats haven't self-destructed.  I think we ran a pretty good campaign considering the circumstances.  The media were quite good to us, on the whole, with a couple of exceptions.
We would do a lot better job at being electorally involved, if more people would join the party.  Just because we lost our Senators doesn't mean we stop being a party.  It was hard in the ACT because of the silly electoral law.  But we will re-register now and rebuild.
If people want the Australian Democrats, they should join the Australian Democrats.  It's all about having an active membership.
Rumours of our death have been grossly exaggerated.  But keep the new blood coming in.  Join, get involved.  You can make a difference.  Help us to "Keep the Bastards Honest!"
Cheers,
Darren Churchill
President
Australian Democrats (ACT Division)
>

 
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Darren Churchill       10/19/2008 10:12:35 AM
Hi,
The Australian Democrats haven't self-destructed.  I think we ran a pretty good campaign considering the circumstances.  The media were quite good to us, on the whole, with a couple of exceptions.
We would do a lot better job at being electorally involved, if more people would join the party.  Just because we lost our Senators doesn't mean we stop being a party.  It was hard in the ACT because of the silly electoral law.  But we will re-register now and rebuild.
If people want the Australian Democrats, they should join the Australian Democrats.  It's all about having an active membership.
Rumours of our death have been grossly exaggerated.  But keep the new blood coming in.  Join, get involved.  You can make a difference.  Help us to "Keep the Bastards Honest!"
Cheers,
Darren Churchill
President
Australian Democrats (ACT Division)
>

 
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Aussiegunneragain    Darren   10/20/2008 4:53:55 AM

Hi,

The Australian Democrats haven't self-destructed.  I think we ran a pretty good campaign considering the circumstances.  The media were quite good to us, on the whole, with a couple of exceptions.


We would do a lot better job at being electorally involved, if more people would join the party.  Just because we lost our Senators doesn't mean we stop being a party.  It was hard in the ACT because of the silly electoral law.  But we will re-register now and rebuild.


If people want the Australian Democrats, they should join the Australian Democrats.  It's all about having an active membership.

Rumours of our death have been grossly exaggerated.  But keep the new blood coming in.  Join, get involved.  You can make a difference.  Help us to "Keep the Bastards Honest!"


Cheers,

Darren Churchill


President

Australian Democrats (ACT Division)


>





Thanks for your contribution Darren. I personally wouldn'tjoin the Dem's as I generally disagree with your economic and national security policies. However I support a lot if not most of your social policy agenda, your freedom from business and union influance and most importantly your willingness to make sensible compromises with the major party that was in power, unlike the bunch of pelican's that have taken the BOP in the ACT now. It is for the later reason that I voted for the Dem's in the Senate on a couple of occasions during your heyday in the federal arena during the 1990's.
 
Unfortunately Ms Stott-Despoja and the majority of your membership base threw your greatest strength, the ability to make a reasonable compromise, out the window during their collective dummy spit over Meg Lee's tax reform decisions. I fear that this did your party irreparable damage, but if you think you can rebuild it and boot the Greens out of the kingmaker role, then you have my best wishes.
 
Personally I don't think that is going to happen unless you differentiate yourselves from the Greens and certain factions in the ALP more. When I listenned to Lyn Allison's address on SBS during the last federal election I couldn't tell what the difference was between what she was saying and the message of the other centre-left parties.
Basically you should keep on the fight on social justice, but you really need to reconsider the evidence about whether the interventionist economic policies that you promote have ever done Australia any good.
 
Cheers,
AG.
 
 
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fall out       10/22/2008 1:16:28 AM
Be afriad AG, be very afraid!! hahaha
 
Democrats began to die the day they allowed Howard to introduce the GST.
 
Id rather the greens hold the bal. of power in the Senate rather than Mr. Non-Family First...

 
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