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Subject: NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS
LJ813    7/1/2005 9:34:17 PM
I WILL GO FOR THE NAVY..
 
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gf0012-aust    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS- stupid comparison   3/6/2006 7:10:20 PM
"Devgru (ST6) and the SBS would be the best comparison...as they are similar in size and capability." I'd have to disagree with that. DEVGRU is literally 10-15 times the size of the SBS. As such, the types and styles of operations would subtley change.
 
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mough    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS- stupid comparison   3/7/2006 1:34:09 AM
not getting into OPSEC issues....but, there are 2500+ guy's in DEVGRU?, even with supporting element's?, or just shooter's?.....that may be pushing it, a bit.
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS- stupid comparison   3/7/2006 11:47:46 AM
No offense, gfaust, but Devgru is the same size as CAG (roughly 200-300 operators)...I have no idea about the SBS, though
 
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PARATROOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/7/2006 8:57:46 PM
The question begs to ask..."what is the mission?"...but as for money and actual combat experience (including survivability0 all take the SAS 5 out of 7 days....yep...
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/7/2006 9:03:32 PM
>>The question begs to ask..."what is the mission?"...but as for money and actual combat experience (including survivability0 all take the SAS 5 out of 7 days....yep...<< Well, let's see your SAS board some ships, conduct hydrographic recon, take down a oil rig, blow up ships with limpet mines, and Bench Press 500lbs.
 
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PARATROOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/7/2006 11:57:12 PM
Mostly because SEALS like to die to much, they have such a terrible operational casualty rate....and no not entirely beacuse they get all the 'f*cked-up' missions..there is something inherent in NAVAL and MARINE ops that has its people die so gloriously..hmmm
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/8/2006 11:31:26 AM
>>Mostly because SEALS like to die to much, they have such a terrible operational casualty rate....and no not entirely beacuse they get all the 'f*cked-up' missions..there is something inherent in NAVAL and MARINE ops that has its people die so gloriously..hmmm<< OK, well this proves you have no idea what you are talking about. I guess you are saying that the SEALs, SBS, Komsubin, and German Combat Swimmers really enjoy dying. Maybe you should look at it like this: On Naval ops, you are probably going to be boarding a ship, clearing a oil platform, planting limpet mines, etc...and a heck of alot more can go wrong on these ops than on land. Think about it. When boarding a clearing a ship, you have to worry about the fast roping onto a moving target (which the waves make the ship fluctuate and you could freakin' break your leg fast roping down onto one), you then have to worry about being stealthy and making sure the crew doesn't fire an RPG at you chopper...then you must clear the ship (talk about close quarters! It gives a whole new meaning to the word) which is much more dangerous then say, clearing a house...you must then exit the ship via helicopter and get the heck out. When clearing an oil platform, you have to some how get onto it, usually by climbing by hand (if you fall you probably die, and if it is cold and ice is on the platform, then you are in serious trouble)...once you make it up, you have to be very stealthy (because if you are taking down an oil platform, their is probably heavy security) and set up a perimeter...then you must take the thing room by room, secure the hostages, and get out. This would be equal to Delta clearing the Embassy (maybe harder). Limpet mines are probably the safest thing they do, but if your air runs out, you place the charge wrong it could blow up in your face, you have to worry about hitting the right target (or face your superiors...which you probably know can be worse than the enemy), etc. Now to Marine Ops. This is pretty simple, really. If you are tasked with taking an Island, then you are going to have to fight to the death...there is no place to retreat. You are probably going to be outnumbered, they are probably going to be entrenched, and you have limited air support (there is only so many harriers and F-18's availible).
 
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Ehran    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/8/2006 2:40:43 PM
Well, let's see your SAS board some ships, conduct hydrographic recon, take down a oil rig, blow up ships with limpet mines, and Bench Press 500lbs. off the list the hydrographic recon is probably the only job that would be a real problem for the SAS. the rest of it shouldn't be a problem to put a team that can do it competently. i could also put together a list of jobs the seals would have troubles with such as any kind of arctic operations longer than a couple days or mountaineering for example. i'd also have to wonder at the utility in benching 500 lbs? sure brute strength would be handy from time to time but i think if you ask any sf type whether the ability to ruck endlessly carrying most of your body weight would be more useful his choice is going to be pretty easy to predict.
 
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GOP    RE:NAVY SEALS VS BRITISH SAS   3/8/2006 3:05:06 PM
>>off the list the hydrographic recon is probably the only job that would be a real problem for the SAS. the rest of it shouldn't be a problem to put a team that can do it competently. i could also put together a list of jobs the seals would have troubles with such as any kind of arctic operations longer than a couple days or mountaineering for example. i'd also have to wonder at the utility in benching 500 lbs? sure brute strength would be handy from time to time but i think if you ask any sf type whether the ability to ruck endlessly carrying most of your body weight would be more useful his choice is going to be pretty easy to predict.<< The SAS aren't super human...they train for CT, and I gaurantee you that they don't train to take down oil platforms, board ships, or any of that stuff. That is the SBS's job. Everyone thinks "The SAS can do anything, including fly to mars and conduct CT against space aliens; go to the depths of the Mariana trench and fight the creature from the blue lagoon; and many SAS operators are direct descendants of superman and batman"...it doesn't work that way. They are trained in CT, not naval warfare...I would imagine that a group of SAS operators would be about as lost at Sea as the SEALs would be on mars. The simple fact is, whether you like it or not, is that the SEAL operators are overall the most versatile force in the world...because they are all trained in naval warfare, HALO, DA, CT, SR, everything. As far as bench pressing 500lbs, it was a lame attempt at humor. Bodyweight is the way to go for SOF missions. I could bench press half of 500lbs, and I wasn't athletic at all. Now I have started using my bodyweight, and I have found that I am much more explosive, I can play basketball longer without my legs getting as tired, and overall I am much more 'fit'. Of course, alot of this has to do with cardio, but you get the idea.
 
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ArtyEngineer    SAS operational Structure - GOP   3/8/2006 3:55:44 PM
GOP, the SAS do indeed have operators who can fulfill the missions of the SBS and SEALS, each SAS squadron is broken down into troops, Mountain Troop, Boat Troop, Air Troop, and Mobility Troop, I think the troop names are self explanatory. The Boat Troop guys are exactly on the same skill set as the SBS.
 
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