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Subject: Who is subverting Saudi Arabia?
YelliChink    3/11/2011 11:56:19 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/03/11/saudi.arabia.protests/index.html (CNN) -- Defying a government ban on all kinds of public demonstrations, a group is planning a "Day of Rage" protests Friday in Saudi Arabia.
 
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YelliChink       3/11/2011 12:03:08 PM
Who are this "group?"
 
Enough is enough. Destabilizing Saudi Arabia would be devastating to the world. I truly am disgusted by the regime, but the subversion of Saudi royals in this case will only make Saudi an Iranian puppet. Whoever is doing this is aiming for yet another oil crisis.
 
And judging from casualty report yesterday, Saudi police were indeed using rubber bullets and some other less-than-lethal means. The mainstream media is co-opted with the "group," which is neither Islamic nor indigenous to Arabs.
 
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Reactive       3/11/2011 12:17:34 PM

Who are this "group?"

 

Enough is enough. Destabilizing Saudi Arabia would be devastating to the world. I truly am disgusted by the regime, but the subversion of Saudi royals in this case will only make Saudi an Iranian puppet. Whoever is doing this is aiming for yet another oil crisis.

 
Ok YC, let's make this simple for you, IF YOU LIVED UNDER THAT REGIME would you be CONTENT? If not might it occur to you that you would support an uprising if it promised a better life for yourself. It amazes me that your ignorance prevents you from seeing that people will not risk their lives and those of their families merely because some foreign conspiracy encourages it.
 
And around 10% of Saudi is Shia, there's about as much chance of Saudi Arabia becoming an Iranian puppet as there is of you becoming a card-carrying member of a militant feminist and gay rights group.

But then just a week or so ago you were saying, with your usual ignorance that Gaddaffi was finished within a day or two, care to retract that mistake?

 
And judging from casualty report yesterday, Saudi police were indeed using rubber bullets and some other less-than-lethal means. The mainstream media is co-opted with the "group," which is neither Islamic nor indigenous to Arabs.

People are protesting in Saudi Arabia because LIKE YOU THEY ARE DISGUSTED BY THE REGIME, they are disgusted at thousands of spoiled prick Saud Family members being given yearly stipends of hundreds of thousands of dollars to blow on all manner of vice across the world whilst they themselves live in one of the most repressive, backwards, and intolerant states on EARTH.
 
The fact that it is disastrous for the economy if unrest spreads is what they call "making your bed", we are happy to support murderous, corrupt scum (house of saud) if they keep the oil flowing, the fact that we (the west) has never pressed that house to make any reforms and instead encouraged the House of Saud to invest hugely in US property and infrastructure, it's DUMB, and was always, long term, a recipe for failure.
 
Which is why it is better to operate long term based on principles as well as short-term fiscal stability, as GF said in another post, the US is losing its voice in the middle-east, that's no conspiracy, it's just that there is no moral high ground from which they (or we) can speak to the people.
 
R
 
 
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YelliChink       3/11/2011 1:27:45 PM

People are protesting in Saudi Arabia because LIKE YOU THEY ARE DISGUSTED BY THE REGIME, they are disgusted at thousands of spoiled prick Saud Family members being given yearly stipends of hundreds of thousands of dollars to blow on all manner of vice across the world whilst they themselves live in one of the most repressive, backwards, and intolerant states on EARTH.

  

R


 


Your imagination about people over there is parting you from reality. People in Saudi Arabia don't have problem executing converts from Islam, stoning for adultery and prohibiting building of Christian churches to serve large number of foreign workers. The list of ridiculous, 7th Century religious laws goes on. They don't rise up against the unfair treatment of women and still marry within their family. These are very different people from Westerners, Hindus, Hispanics, both North/South East Asias, non-Muslim Africans and even Indonesians.
People rise up there not because of Saudi royals abuse the system or lack of women's right in the feminist book, but rather because the royals are Sunni and they are Shia. There is no difference in interpretation and implementation of Sharia, the only difference is sectarian. You are mistaking what's going on in Saudi and Bahrain.

The real reason that Saudi royals impose these laws is due to that the Wahabists clergy have trememdous power and influence. Before 1979, the Sauds were more relax in life style choice. Since the failed military coup, they co-opted with Wahabists in order to maintain in power. Whether you like it or not, the power structure there is shaped by the culture, not vice versa. In this case, you'd better have the Sauds running the show, unless you want oil crisis.
 
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YelliChink       3/11/2011 1:41:02 PM




But then just a week or so ago you were saying, with your usual ignorance that Gaddaffi was finished within a day or two, care to retract that mistake?


 

R


 



Yeah, he is finished, and I have never said that "within a day or two." He is burning cash real fast with this civil war going on. Let's see how long the mercs will work for him without $2000-3000/day paycheck. The Siege of Zawiya has crippled his most loyal merc brigade, and the actions in Ras Lanuf is more like a cry wolf incident by the Benghazi government. With all the mechanized equipment, Gadhafi's forces failed to encircle and destroy disorganized and under-equiped rebel troops. They have only a thousand or two available, and there is no way they can take on Benghazi.  Besides, given how most Western governments have screwed Gadhafi, there is no way that they will allow Gadhafi to remain in position.
 
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YelliChink       3/11/2011 3:20:55 PM
BTW, Shitte in Saudi is minority, but they happen to significantly numerous around Persian Gulf region, where most of Saudi's oil reserve lays beneath.
 
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Nanheyangrouchuan       3/11/2011 9:51:21 PM
All Iran may want to do is split SA and get control of the oil fields, which happen to be in the region where Iranian friendly Shiites live.  That would also give Iran complete control of the Gulf.
 
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Plutarch       3/11/2011 11:07:01 PM














But then just a week or so ago you were saying, with your usual ignorance that Gaddaffi was finished within a day or two, care to retract that mistake?









 



R






 









Yeah, he is finished, and I have never said that "within a day or two." He is burning cash real fast with this civil war going on. Let's see how long the mercs will work for him without $2000-3000/day paycheck. The Siege of Zawiya has crippled his most loyal merc brigade, and the actions in Ras Lanuf is more like a cry wolf incident by the Benghazi government. With all the mechanized equipment, Gadhafi's forces failed to encircle and destroy disorganized and under-equiped rebel troops. They have only a thousand or two available, and there is no way they can take on Benghazi.  Besides, given how most Western governments have screwed Gadhafi, there is no way that they will allow Gadhafi to remain in position.


Source? Link? And are those  mercs flying those Migs and driving those tanks...I forget? Qaddafi has real support in Tripoli, which amounts to about one-third of the total population of Libya. Also, he has some support in the south. Does he have poor command and control...probably. Nobody said Qaddafi or his officers were military geniuses, but it takes time to make war on rebellion (messy and slow like someone famous once said...eating soup with a knife).
 
It will all come down to political will, and the more the Western governments isolate Qaddafi and his followers, the harder they will fight. They have no choice. The alternative is a docket in the Hague and a quick execution as you advocated once. Given that choice, no surprise that they will fight to the death. 
 
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Plutarch       3/11/2011 11:08:50 PM

All Iran may want to do is split SA and get control of the oil fields, which happen to be in the region where Iranian friendly Shiites live.  That would also give Iran complete control of the Gulf.

Yup, between their stooges in Iraq, and now possible control of Bahrain, they would have a near monopoly on Gulf oil, if they can control those oil fields.
 
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Reactive       3/13/2011 12:26:20 PM



All Iran may want to do is split SA and get control of the oil fields, which happen to be in the region where Iranian friendly Shiites live.  That would also give Iran complete control of the Gulf.



Yup, between their stooges in Iraq, and now possible control of Bahrain, they would have a near monopoly on Gulf oil, if they can control those oil fields.
4 words,
 
After hell freezes over.
 
That would be a suicidal move and it wouldn't be SA they'd have to worry about, as we're well aware - even so how do they achieve this faced with Saudi air power?#

R
 
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YelliChink       3/13/2011 9:21:49 PM

4 words,

 

After hell freezes over.

 

That would be a suicidal move and it wouldn't be SA they'd have to worry about, as we're well aware - even so how do they achieve this faced with Saudi air power?#




R


One word: Houthi.
 
They did it to circumvent direct confrontation with the Sauds. A lot of people are pissing by the Iranians, but there's not much they can do about it.
 
Sauds have a lot of nice equipment, but their logistics are the problem. Iranians have opposite problem.
 
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