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Subject: The Coalition to Preserve Civilization
sofa    2/27/2007 11:27:35 AM
from:"http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2006/11/coalition-to-preserve-civilization.html" http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2006/11/coalition-to-preserve-civilization.html Read the whole thing. excerpts below. --- The Coalition to Preserve Civilization by Baron Bodissey The Great Islamic Jihad is certain that Western Civilization is about to come to an end. Islamic Fascism looks forward to the rule of the new Caliphate, in which the whole world will swear submission to Allah and bow five times a day towards Mecca. It aims to kill or enslave every person who will not accept its twisted vision of Islam. With the help of its allies among the world’s dictators and within our own media, it is confident that it will achieve its goal. But even as this beast tears at our throats, a new defensive force is being born, a determination to preserve all that is good and right and true within the Western world. Even as we are abandoned by our leaders, by the sophists in our academies, and by the propagandists of our major media, ordinary people are connecting with one another, and are ready to stand up and defeat those who would destroy us. ... It’s time to wake up. There is no way to escape it, no matter what our policies, and whoever our elected representatives are. There is no escape because our enemies are fully committed to our destruction, and they will not stop until they have either destroyed us, or have been destroyed. That is our choice: we can win or lose, but we cannot opt out and walk away from the greatest threat and most resistant threat this country has ever faced.
 
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kane       3/3/2007 3:24:40 AM
Sofa you're point is wrong
Ottomans weren't trying to spread Islam and they weren't trying to destroy west
Ottomans didn't wipe out anyone either
Ottomans were just uniting people under their banner
+Ottomans were more advanced than west untill 1600s


 
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kane       3/3/2007 3:29:44 AM

plutarch-you're calling me names because I tell you it's in the koran? everything you find offensive is in the koran, and is espoused in mosques every day. Read the koran and hadiths.

 

 


It is because you're reading it from wrong resources
They're probably written by people who think like you
 
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scuttlebut steve    the second coming of commie red herrings   3/4/2007 6:33:52 PM
what is the point of this thread?  Are you saying that the west should slaughter or force convert all muslims or something?  many groups of christians have waged war, destroyed cultures, and commited horrible acts "in the name of Christ", but we accept that they are extremists with dark age views who do not represent christian values but distort them.  Christianity as a whole has adapted to changing times much better which is why there is so many more islamic militant extremists, and the primary cause of this is probably the fact that western countries have had increasing seperation of church and state for hundreds of years and in the islamic world the religion is the state, and can retard social progress.  In the western world the church is forced to change and adapt but the muslim world maitains the same outlook that was prevalent in 7th century.  Islamic fundementalists are no different from fundementalist wakos from other faiths except the numbers are higher and combining vigilance against terror and efforts at social reform is the best way to bring the muslim world up to date and in a position to be at peace with christians and jews, not subjugation or elimination of their culture and history.
 
By the way if you think some extremists can suppress or destroy christian culture than you may be a little paraniod.
 
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sofa       3/10/2007 5:11:37 PM
the point of the post is that information and truth need to be disseminated, and mis-information need to be countered.
 
Fact 1: Islam's stated goal is destuction of other civilizations.
Fact 2: Out of 167 terrorist organizations in the world, 164 are Islamic.
Fact 3: Out of 30 conflicts that are on-going in the world, 28 are directly related to islam.
 
We have to discuss strategies by which we can defeat this doctrine of hate. 
 
Ignoring reality = insanity
 
 
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sofa    Latest struggle in a very old war   3/10/2007 5:12:52 PM
Christians believe that “love conquers all.” Well, love does not conquer Islam. Christians have a difficult time seeing Islam as a political doctrine, not a religion. 
  

Multiculturalism is bankrupt against Islam’s demand for every civilization to submit. The culture of tolerance collapses in the face of the sacred intolerance of dualistic ethics. Intellectuals respond by ignoring the failure.

 

Look at the parallels between the response of abuse victims and our intellectuals. See how violence has caused denial.

 

The victims deny that the abuse took place: Our media never reports the majority of jihad around the world. Our intellectuals don’t talk about how all of the violence is connected to a political doctrine.

 

The abuser uses fear to control the victim: What was the reason that newspapers would not publish the Mohammed cartoon? Salman Rushdie still has a death sentence for his novel. What “cutting edge” artist creates any artistic statement about Islam? Fear rules our intellectuals and artists.

 

The victims find ways to blame themselves: We are to blame for the attacks on September 11, 2001. If we try harder Muslims will act nicer. We have to accommodate their needs.

 

The victim is humiliated: White people will not talk about how their ancestors were enslaved by Islam. No one wants to claim the victims of jihad. Why won’t we claim the suffering of our ancestors? Why don’t we cry about the loss of cultures and peoples? We are too ashamed to care.

 

The victim feels helpless: “What are we going to do?” “We can’t kill 1.3 billion people.” No one has any understanding or optimism. No one has an idea of what to try. The only plan is to “be nicer.”

 

The victim turns the anger inward: What is the most divisive issue in today’s politics? Iraq. And what is Iraq really about? Political Islam. The Web has a video about how the CIA and Bush planned and executed September 11. Cultural self-loathing is the watchword of our intellectuals and artists.

 

We hate ourselves because we are mentally molested and abused. Our intellectuals and artists have responded to the abuse of jihad just as a sexually abused child or a rape victim would

 
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swhitebull    list of terrorist orgs from my database   3/10/2007 5:39:35 PM

the point of the post is that information and truth need to be disseminated, and mis-information need to be countered.

 

Fact 1: Islam's stated goal is destuction of other civilizations.

Fact 2: Out of 167 terrorist organizations in the world, 164 are Islamic.

Fact 3: Out of 30 conflicts that are on-going in the world, 28 are directly related to islam.

 

We have to discuss strategies by which we can defeat this doctrine of hate. 
 

Ignoring reality = insanity

 


OrganizationIDNumber Group Name Country Acronym Original Language Name Status Active Members Comments
2 Jamaat e Islami Afghanistan   Active  
3 National Islamic Movement Afghanistan NIM [Jumbish-i-Milli] Active  
4 Northern Alliance Afghanistan   Active  
5 Taliban Afghanistan     
6 Taliban Militia Afghanistan   Active  
7 United Islamic Front for the Salvation of Afghanistan Afghanistan UIFSA  Active  
1 Harkat-i-Islami Afghanistan   Active  
10 Belmokhtar Group Algeria     
11 Islamic Salvation Front / Islamic Salvation Army Algeria FIS/AIS "[Front Islamique du Salut, Armee Islamique du Salut]" Active  
9 Armed Islamic Group Algeria GIA [Groupe Islamique Armee] Active  
12 Salafist Group for Preaching and Combat (GSPC) Algeria     
8 Alliance for a Free Kabylie Algeria AKAL  Uncertain  
15 Cabinda Enclave Liberation Front - Renovada Angola FLEC-R [Frente de Libertacao do Enclave de Cabinda-Renovada] Active  
16 National Union for the Total Independence of Angola Angola UNITA [Union Nacional para a Independencia Total de Angola] Active  
14 Cabinda Enclave Liberation Front - Cabinda Armed Forces Angola FLEC-FAC [Frente de LEC-Forcas Armadas Cabindesas] Active  
13 Cabinda Democratic Front Angola FDC [Frente Democratica de Cabinda]   
18 People's Extra Parliamentary Opposition Austria VAPO  Active  
17 Bavarian Liberation Army Austria BLA  Active  
426 Azeri Islamic Party Azerbaijan AIP   0 
19 Hezbollah-Gulf/Bahrain Bahrain   Active  
20 Islamic Front for the Liberation of Bahrain Bahrain IFLB  Active  
21 Movement for the Liberation of Bahrain Bahrain MLB  Active  
22 Shanti Bahini Bangladesh   Cease-fire  
24 Fighting Communist Cells Belgium CCC [Cellules Communistes Combattantes] Dormant  
26 Tupac Katari Guerrilla Army Bolivia EGTK [Ejercito Guerrillero Tupac Katari] Possibly active  
25 National Liberation Army - Bolivia Bolivia ELN [Ejército de Liberación Nacional] "Dormant, 1996"  
28 National Council for the Defense of Democracy Burundi CNDD [Conseil National pour la Défense de la Démocratie] Active  
29 National Liberation Forces Burundi FNL [Forces Nationales de Libération] Active  
30 National Liberation Front Burundi Frolina [Front de Libération Nationale] Active  
31 Party for the Liberation of the Hutu People Burundi PLPH [Parti pour la Libération du Peuple Hutu] Active  
27 Forces for the Defense of Democracy Burundi FDD [Forces pour la Défense de la Democratie] Active  
32 Party of Democratic Kampuchea Cambodia  [Khmer Rouge] Active  
33 Front de Liberation du Quebec Canada FLQ  Inactive  
38 National Council for Rebuilding Chad Chad CNTR    
42 Union of Democratic Forces Chad UFD [Union des Forces Démocrati

 
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sofa       3/10/2007 6:10:40 PM
"It is because you're reading it from wrong resources
They're probably written by people who think like you"
 
That a peach!
 
People like me = People who try to separate fact from fiction
 
Read the koran and hadiths. You pick the translations.
Read about Mecca and Medina sections, and abbrogation.
Look at how those words come to life in the world today.
Then thank me for opening your eyes.
 
 
 
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kane       3/15/2007 1:03:02 PM

"It is because you're reading it from wrong resources
They're probably written by people who think like you"

 

That a peach!

 


People like me = People who try to separate fact from fiction


 

Read the koran and hadiths. You pick the translations.

Read about Mecca and Medina sections, and abbrogation.

Look at how those words come to life in the world today.

Then thank me for opening your eyes.

 

 


How do you know what you read is right?It is now a fact that there are zillions of people who want to show Islam bad
The translations you read are probably translated by these guys
Extremist Muslims do the same,they change it and brainwash people with BS,things that are not in Koran
In Koran things are not said directly,it needs a pro to understand.A master of Arabic language and a good historian can read it.Some words had multiple meanings in Arabic and people can change them in what they want
 
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Shirrush    Maybe it's not too late   3/15/2007 2:58:21 PM
...To resist Islamic conquest.
If do dimly remember (not by names unfortunately) that the resistance started in the early '70s in West Africa, where the need for it was most pressing. Its failure in this territory has been mostly ascribed to the lack of support on behalf of the appeasers of the Church of Rome, for whom it was, already then, more important not to appear as "borderline racist" than to defend their turf and help their flock. Now, if you want your grandkids to live in a temperate-climate Nigeria, keep Plutarch's political correctness going.
The CPC plan is attractive because it does not advocate any violence or brutality. What remains to be seen is whether it will have any effectiveness, especially in Europe where anything even vaguely remindful of Western Civilization is seen as an unclean remnant of a very, very guilty past.
My advice: if you want a good look at a future that wasn't because of Islam, look no further than Western and Subsaharian Africa. Do you want to be Darfured?

 
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eu4ea       3/15/2007 3:22:14 PM
I never cease to be amazed with how childish Sofa's arguments can get.

Islam=root of all evil, coalitions of heroes to "defend civilization", etc. is a comic-book version of reality.  No doubt satisfying in it's simplicity, but not related to actual reality in any substantive way.

I can already sense your reaction, so before you go there - hold your horses. I'm far from being pro-Islam.  If anything I'd say the view of it that most closely mirror's my own is Ibn Warraq's (see his excellent book "Why I am not a Muslim"). 

However, the childish violence advocated here is in an entirely different category, right up there with other versions of similar violent prejudices fashionable at different historical times (Jews are evil,  Sikhs are bastards,  Christians are blasphemers, Atheists must all die or what-have-you).

The truth of the matter is that the rise of violent Islam has everything to do with a whole range of other factors, most of which are outside of Islam itself.  The elephant in the middle of the room is oil - not the substance itself, but what it does to societies that happen to be unfortunate enough to have it under their soil.

Yep, you heard right: "unfortunate".  The bottom line is that societies cursed with massive abundance of an exportable resource (whether it be oil, gold, diamonds, spices or whatever) have consistently been messed-up throughout history.  That very abundance brings dependence, violence and governments that are not accountable to their subjects, because they are not economically dependent on them.  Oil in the middle east is just the most radical example of an established common trend - so was Zambian and copper, sugar in Latin America, spices in the Pacific, just about every diamond producer, etc.

The predictable results are massive inequality, repression, violence, corruption, and disdain for productive activity, often coupled with overpopulation and an overabundance of unemployed, unemployable and disgruntled young males.  Which happens to be precisely what we're seeing in the Middle East.  Islam is the not the root but merely the mechanism for that to blow up.

Solutions?  "Fighting Islam" is not one. Try "fighting judaism" or "fighting christianity" and see whether that leads to pacification. Which is not to say we dont need to carry out police actions and chase after the most radicalized and dangerous members - absolutely, we must. Just dont have any illusion that we're goign to "solve" the problem by doing that.

The actual solution is simpler, and more radical: Stop sending boatloads of money to the corrupt governments of the area.  Achieve that, and we've won.  Fail to do so and we'll continue to fight this nonsense indefinitively.

Is that easy?  No.  Is it achievable? Absolutely.  In fact, it's the kind of thing we do best. 

The "war on terror" wont be won by chest-thumping ideologues,  foreign military adventures, spooks or military contractors.  It will be won by the geeks and venture capitalists in Silicon Valley who are currently developing hypercapacitors, fuel cells, solar collectors, low-cost panels, microturbines, plug-in hybdrids and and genetically engineered bacteria that can produce cellulosic ethanol, to name just a few.  It will be won by nuclear power plantt,  mid-west farmers growing ethanol, and wind farms in Texas. American capitalism and not chest-thumping ideology is what's going to win this one.

The most we can expect from the soldiers, spooks and smart bombs is that they can hold the line until the geeks get in on the action.  Which they are doing, poorly.

Heart,

eu4ea

 
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